Warriors Wiki talk:Characters

Character Overviews
Looking around on a few wikis, I've noticed that all of them have a brief description of the characters prior to going in depth in their history, for example:

Firestar was the leader of ThunderClan prior to his death. As an apprentice, he joined ThunderClan, abandoning his kittypet life and becoming Firepaw. During his training, he developed two friends - Graypaw and Ravenpaw. He figured out the reason behind Redtail's death thanks to Ravenpaw, and hid him in a barn. Firepaw then became Fireheart, and Graypaw Graystripe. Fireheart spent much of his warrior life setting out to prove Tigerclaw's treachery, and when Tigerclaw is caught in the act trying to kill Bluestar, Fireheart saves Bluestar's life. Fireheart then becomes the deputy of ThunderClan, saving it from several more plots of revenge by Tigerclaw, who becomes Tigerstar. Firestar won the battle against BloodClan when Tigerstar used them to try to take over the forest, killing Scourge. Following the events of the first series, he finds a lost Clan and rebuilds them to become SkyClan along with his mate, Sandstorm. Following the events of the first series, he leads his Clan through the mountains to their new home and helps them settle in. In the books after, he continues to remain ThunderClan's leader until his death in the The Last Hope, killing Tigerstar once and for all.

It's honestly just a brief brief description, or a summary of their lives in which I think would be very benefical to character articles, however, main characters, not minor characters. That's a rough guideline of some sort, but like I think a character such as Greeneyes wouldn't need it. Then again, this is just a very rough idea and it's something I doubt would go through anyways, I just wanted to suggest it. Comments on this? Try not to kill me by the way. 01:30, March 15, 2016 (UTC)

I actually agree Icy, I think it's a pretty good idea. When I saw it on other wikis before I used to think that it wasn't a very good idea, but now that I think about it, it would be a really practical way for someone just to read about a character and know what they did throughout the series without having to spend like an hour to read the whole history section. Because some of the major characters, like Firestar and Gray Wing and such, have really long histories and it would be a relief to also have a summary paragraph and just see all of what happened to them instead of having to skim the whole thing. So basically I like the idea. 02:37 Tue Mar 15

Eh, I'm not sure if I like this idea or not... mainly because I feel a lot of the main characters already have fairly large articles as it is... but I suppose I'll take a bit more time and think about it before fully having an opinion.

I think that perhaps it'd be nice, but I think we should get the main articles of characters first. It's a idea, but don't think it should be too high of a priority because of the amount of articles on the concerns list.

My basic point is that I think a brief short of the character would be beneficial in the long run. I know that when I look at a character I don't really have time to read the entire article so seeing the short description does help me. And this isn't a matter of laziness, I just think it's convenient. 03:32, March 16, 2016 (UTC)

I'm 50-50 on this. It'll be useful for pretty major characters with long histories but then again, most people have read the books and typically don't need it.Stealth f🔥re ❤Warriors Forever!❤  22:18, March 25, 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, but some people haven't read every single book which is kinda my point here. 22:10, March 31, 2016 (UTC)

I'm still not sure if I like the idea, but that's because I haven't had the chance to think about it... but will everything be cited, or is it just going to be written as a normal history section would be? Personally, given how it's supposed to be brief and have important facts, I think it should probably be cited in one form or another...

Imo, it should be cited, considering that it is facts about the character. 22:43 Thu Mar 31

I'd be more for the idea if it was all cited... It would be helpful for the major characters.

So we have two people agreeing to my idea and 2 people 50/50. Can we have some more comments? 02:31, April 3, 2016 (UTC)

I think this is a fantastic idea! I sometimes need to check something like " Who found out about Tigerclaw killing Redtail?" Having this summary would make that articles look nicer as well! 21:29, April 6, 2016 (UTC)

Have we reached a conclusion? 21:10, April 10, 2016 (UTC)

I'm still 50-50. I mean it will definitely needs cites but yeah their might be argument over what exactly what will put there. Like Firestar for example, he has a lot in the first series and then not so much in the second and third series.Stealth f🔥re ❤Warriors Forever!❤  01:01, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

I feel like it'd be really hard to do characters like Lionblaze that sorta fade away, but were really major at some point. (he barely was mentioned in TAQ) I'm on the edge like Stealth, but I'd be completely against it without cites^

honestly I disagree even with cites, because its still really subject to peoples opinions. what one person could read as stubborn could be read as determined or something in another persons eyes. 12:51, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

I don't think we should even include any "personality traits" or something. But have we reached a conclusion? 17:07, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

I don't believe there should be a character overview as the history is already fine as it is.

Yeah, there most definitely shouldn't be character traits, only cited facts

Fernpaw (TAQ), Ferntail, and Featherpelt
Bit of a conundrum here, guys. We have three different cats, but only two of them actually appear.

Ferntail is apparently supposed to be the kit of Sedgewhisker and Emberfoot, and Crowfeather's apprentice, as seen on Kate's blog. She isn't shown in the allegiance list for The Apprentice's Quest, both the iBooks preview and the official release.

Featherpelt appears, though, and she has the same description as Ferntail, but she is, without a doubt, the Featherpaw from Bramblestar's Storm, and one of Crowfeather's apprentices. There isn't anything doubting the canonocity of this character whatsoever... but it is interesting that she shares the same exact description and mentor as "Ferntail".

There's also a Fernpaw, and this she-cat has a totally different description. She's a dark brown she-cat, an allegiance-only character, and doesn't show up in the list we got from Kate.

What exactly should we do about this? We can't really add anything for Ferntail, since she doesn't exist as of the book release. Should we just delete Ferntail's page? Given that Ferntail is also listed as a kit of Sedgewhisker and does have littermates... this doesn't quite make sense.

We can't just have an empty article, though.

Add Ferntail to the minor chacter page? Inconsistencies. Great editors, Warriors. Just great. I'm actually getting seriously tired of all of these inconsistencies 03:31, March 16, 2016 (UTC)

But Ferntail doesn't exist anymore, so she's technically not a character. I don't think we can put her on the minor characters page.

Trivia? 14:51, March 16, 2016 (UTC)

I think it should definitely be trivia, because for example Jayclaw was originally named Jaywing(it's in his trivia), but it had been changed since Kate's blog on the allegiances.

Ferntail was in an early version of the allegiances, of course there will be some changes. I'd say delete because they do not appear in the final version.Stealth f🔥re ❤Warriors Forever!❤  22:18, March 25, 2016 (UTC)

No, I still think they should be in the trivia. They were mentioned, after all. 22:29, March 31, 2016 (UTC)

I agree, it shoud be in their trivia, but they should be categorized as mentioned characters. Or, of course, Kate could be asked since I think she made the draft? But imo, the page shouldn't be deleted, it should just be in their trivia that they got drafted out of the final copy. 23:03 Mon Apr 4

I'm not sure it makes sense for the pages to be kept, though? They'd just be empty and sitting there. Characters who get changed have their old names serving as a redirect; such as Troutfin, when the name was changed to Milkfur... a trivia statement wouldn't hurt, just like I did for Stonewing and Jayclaw. I'm only asking this time because there seems to be a bit of a mixup with the apprentice/general list, and not just a name swap.

Have we reached a conclusion? 21:10, April 10, 2016 (UTC)

Well I was just looking and it is said that Fernpaw (TAQ) is the one that's Crowfeather's apprentice. — Minkclaw River is Beauty, Beauty is Everything. 15:56, April 21, 2016 (UTC)

I think that we should just leave Ferntail to the trivia and probably delete her page, and put Featherpelt and Fernpaw in the trivia as well. 15:59, April 21, 2016 (UTC)

I think that the trivia for Ferntail should also be in the trivia for The Apprentice's Quest as she was mentioned in Allegiances for TAQ on BlogClan.

Unoffical leaders (SPOILERS)
Sorry I should've brought it up with PC prior to doing anything. Okay so unofficial leaders, I know that this has been discussed before but in Darktail's case, he was heavily referred to a leader so many times Alderpaw was just like "why isn't he called Darkstar you dumdums". He refers to himself as a leader several times, and they drove SkyClan out and he is the leader of the rogues technically, and they all listen to him and stuff like that. Does that make him a leader, or should we put it as unofficialy? Same thing goes for Jingo, by the way. 14:21, March 16, 2016 (UTC)

A leader is a leader, regardless. At the same time, it would also be appropriate to clearly define what the leader rank is. Is it only a Clan rank, and if it is, then why are these cats clearly labeled as leaders of their own group? If so, then what's to say for cats like Furled Bracken and Stone Song, who were very much leaders of the Ancient group of cats we saw in Long Shadows and Sign of the Moon, and why aren't they entitled to a leader charart?

Is our blank only a Clan leader charart? If so, then why are all Clan leaders marked with "Leader" instead of "Clan Leader", when the leader rank itself is shown to be used elsewhere? Slash's group, Darktail's group (they'd also get a page, I think?????), Jingo's group, the Ancient cats, BloodClan, ect. There are multiple groups within the series that have a clear leader of their group, but they don't get anything special.

Right now I think we should think of status, not charart. What I'm thinking is that we have a leader, but maybe in the trivia it says they're not a Clan leader? Or maybe Leader (Unofficially), and officially can be a Clan? Idk I'm tired 14:30, March 16, 2016 (UTC)

They're tied together, and you can't talk about one without bringing up the other, Icy. =P And technically, cats like Slash, Darktail, Furled Bracken, and Stone Song aren't unofficial. They are called leaders, and multiple times at that. They're just not Clan leaders, which makes me think we need to redefine what a leader is and who does and doesn't count.

a leader is a leader, regardless of the group, they have the same job even if they don't have the same methods, the only real difference is the nine lives the clan leaders get, so they really should get some kind of rank acknowledgement. all in all it's just up to the wiki itself if we want to use the images for non clan cats or not. 14:35, March 16, 2016 (UTC)

I hate to say this, but maybe we could have a blank for non-clan leaders? But this is PC, and I think we can call them leaders (non-clan) or something like that. We need to acknowledge that they are leaders, but not Clan leaders. 14:51, March 16, 2016 (UTC)

They are most definitely leaders, but perhaps we could create a Non-Clan Leader rank/category for them? I do agree that each group probably should have it's own page, as said above.

There are so many examples of non-Clan leaders that I'm surprised this rank hasn't been brought in before.Stealth f🔥re ❤Warriors Forever!❤  22:33, March 25, 2016 (UTC)

Comments?<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  01:12, April 6, 2016 (UTC)

I think a leader is a leader regardless whether it is of a clan or another group because isn't a clan just a group? 21:21, April 6, 2016 (UTC)

Have we reached a conclusion?<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  06:22, April 18, 2016 (UTC)

Major Characters
Woo another discussion again. Okay so I've been musing over this for a while, and what is our definition of a major character? For example, I believe that Cloud Spots, Dappled Pelt, Pebble Heart, and Acorn Fur could be included in the major character list for Moth Flight's Vision, as they appear a number of times and help Moth Flight out a lot. However, I do disagree with several cats on the major character list, such as Tigerstar and Firestar for Omen of the Stars. Do we even have a definition? If so, what is it? And if we don't, can we come up with one and apply it to the articles? Or does anyone even want to change the major character list as we have it now? 22:38, March 31, 2016 (UTC)

I'd be okay to having Pebble Heart, as major, but the others weren't really much more than supporting imo. The current list doesn't really need to change too much... Tigerstar appears a lot in OoTS, and Firestar, not as much I guess but he's still there a lot.

I think Cloud Spots could be considered major, to a point. He does appear quite frequently.. but I think the more important question here is do we really have a definition (not talking literal, but what PC would count as) for 'main', 'major', 'supporting', 'minor', 'mentioned', and 'allegiance-only'? It does seem to me that these things have more of a 'it's up to the person(s) writing the article' air, so perhaps we could discuss that too?

The tutorial we have does outline this a little, but you are right we need a more outlined definition.<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  23:01, April 4, 2016 (UTC)

I think the definitions for which characters are Main ,Minor and Allegiance-nly are pretty clear, as per the blurbs on their Category pages. The supporting, minor, and mentioned definitions could use clarification.

Main characters, yes, as they need a PoV in order to be listed as one (as far as I'm aware; this could be wrong, but it's how I've always operated)... but I'm willing to bet that with major, it could very well be called into question. What determines if a character is major? How important they are to the plot? How many appearances they have? Their relevance to the main characters? The entire thing needs to be rehashed and thought out in detail, because we have a lot more characters than when those pages were initially created and the concept thought up. What worked back then might not work now, if only for the massive amount of characters we have.

Have we reached a conclusion (or a definition)? 21:10, April 10, 2016 (UTC)

Not really. We seem to give an importance to a character by book. For example, Stick is considered a major, although he is pretty minor in the entire series, he has a PoV in SkyClan's Destiny.<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  01:05, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

Character Ages
Alright, so, I had a nice piece of information sent to me on tumblr last week, and I figure that it's kinda important, since it revolves around the character ages on the articles. Now, some of these appear to be right...but others don't make a lick of sense? tldr the image explains what I'm trying to say... but I really think we need to rethink when we add ages to character pages, because something's not right here. Do we try and fix these mistakes (as there are quite a few), or do we try something else instead?

I think we need this general rule: The ages will only change when a new book comes out and nothing else. I think partially the reason people are mixed up because maths is not the easiest in the world and it's hard to tell how much time passes in books sometimes. I think yes fix the mistakes and be very strict about ages being changed. Maybe only a certain few users (like the charart being changed on the character pages) are allowed to edit these ages. Might be a little hard to reinforce at first but people will eventually get it.<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  00:36, April 7, 2016 (UTC)

Stealthfire makes a good point. Jaysnow (talk) 00:37, April 7, 2016 (UTC)

I can reread the entire series and pinpoint the characters' almost exact ages by taking notes.

Let's try to fix all these mistakes. I know seeing the characters' ages helps me out a ''ton. ''Why don't we use the Events Timeline for a reference when we're done fixing it up? 00:42, April 7, 2016 (UTC)

Why not just start over with the ages? Delete them from the character articles for now, rework the system (and when and why the ages are updated, just like Stealth said), and then put them back on the character pages? We could always use a PC subpage or something along those lines to have the approx. ages and the evidence that proves it?

I agree; I know that the DTC timeline is being made, and I think that would make it much easier to track the DTC cats' ages when that is finalized. For the other cats too, though, I agree that it would be a good idea to just clear it for now and add it back in later when the ages are updated. <span style="">02:10 Thu Apr 7

I think on a page ( timeline page or character ages) we should have a rough moon time scale. ie how many moons have past since Tallstar was made an apprentice till when was Bluestars made leader. This would help us get an accurate time span. 10:44, April 7, 2016 (UTC)

I think we should take them off for now, fix them, then put them back on. There's so many characters, and it'd be good to take them off temporarily to make sure we don't forget anyone.

I think it's better to leave them just on (for now) and make a subpage to put down notes per book and then change the ages for each specific character. It would probably be best to start with Into the Wild, since I will be reading the book shortly.

Have we reached a conclusion? R(Right now I'm working on a timeline so maybe I can help with this.) 21:10, April 10, 2016 (UTC)

I'm going to poke this. 15:53, April 18, 2016 (UTC)

Have we reached a conclusion or no? 17:08, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

It's seems to me that everybody agrees that the ages should be taken off, then added back on later when the timeline is fixed. <span style="">18:41 Sat Apr 23

Rain (TAQ) ~ Silver Nomination
Interesting, this isn't the first cat named 'Rain' who I have nominated... Comments? <span style="">04:04 Sat Apr 16

CBV?<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  05:50, April 21, 2016 (UTC)

Vote's up! 17:11, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

Strikepaw ~ Silver Nomination
Another very minor character. Credit goes to everyone else who worked on it, I only added detail to his mention. Comments? <span style="">21:07 Sat Apr 16

CBV?<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  05:50, April 21, 2016 (UTC)

Vote's up! 17:11, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

Juniperpaw ~ Silver Nomination
Super, super short character

The cites for the family section, just the BlogClan allegiances isn't really sufficient. Just copy the cites from Dawnpelt's page and those will do.<font color="#0F52BA" face="Segoe">Stealth <font color="#FF0000" face="Segoe">f🔥re <font color="#0067A5" face="Teen">❤Warriors Forever!❤  00:50, April 23, 2016 (UTC)

Silver Nomination for Violetkit
I think she should because her TAQ section is finished and she has a fair amount of quotes.

Foxstep And now I can fly...