Warriors Wiki talk:Charart/Approval Page

=Discussion= Take it to the discussion page

=Tweaked= Take it to the tweak page

=Images Pending Approval=

Please use this section to put images up for approval only.

Queen Blanks ~ For Approval
Righty-o. Here we go with the queen blanks. Comment away my friends. ^w^ 09:42 Tue May 28

I'm no expert on this but maybe square up the shape of this --> forepaw and define where the du-claw'd be. I can't really explain how, the but maybe slope the haunch a bit more, it looks kinda flat compared to the shoulders. Gorgeous work, Berry! 22:15, May 28, 2013 (UTC)

Perhaps ---> this leg could be curved a tad? 22:50 Tue May 28

Maybe you could make both sides of the longhair's tail fluffy? The straight line looks a bit odd. 01:18, May 30, 2013 (UTC)

Do you think you could define the top of the nearest shoulder a bit? Also you might disconnect the line on the same shoulder from the head. As is it looks a bit awkward. You also might define the joints a bit more on the other leg and even out the sizes of the ears. Though I doubt you'd need it, if you need a redline feel free to ask. 2:06 Thu May 30 2013

Maybe the tail can be curved a tad more --- no cat's tail is that straight when they walk. 23:22, May 30, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, Breezy I wouldn't say no to a redline. xD 06:18 Fri May 31

Re-uploaded meh I did some stuff on the shorthair - decided I'll work on the longhairs later. 12:45 Fri May 31

Maybe slant the toe line on her left front paw the other way, or make it straight up and down? And maybe make a small line over the base of her tail where it joins with her haunch on our left; just to show a little more depth. These are really stunning... 00:43, June 1, 2013 (UTC)

Enlarge the hind paw a bit more and maybe define the "ankle" of the leg that's just behind the lifted forepaw 01:24, June 1, 2013 (UTC)

How about these? Ignore the face, though. Yours is fine. Except for maybe the sizes of your ears, which should be more even. 15:48 Mon Jun 3 2013

Re-uploaded officially naming these blanks Hannibal because they look like they want to eat you. 08:17 Fri Jun 7

Umm... what happened to these? They look odd. different. 10:26, June 8, 2013 (UTC)

Perhaps thin and even out the tail lineart a little. 10:33 Sat Jun 8

Re-uploaded. Sorrrel, I was given a redline by Breezy to fix up some anatomy issues. .-. Please do not call my blanks odd, and don't comment unless you're offering critique. 10:45 Sat Jun 8

I'm sorry, Berry. I was just surprised by how different they looked. 12:02, June 8, 2013 (UTC)

Don't know if this'll make any sense, but can you make the curve around our front right paw more noticeable? 13:20, June 8, 2013 (UTC)

The hind thigh looks lumpy. Maybe smooth it out a bit more? The tail seems bigger than the body. Also, define the front right paw (the one that is not on the ground). 15:03, June 8, 2013 (UTC)

I'm very confused; when you go to the file for this is shows that it looks more like the original version; here it looks like the redline Breezey gave you. Is the wiki playing up? Just asking. 01:39, June 9, 2013 (UTC)

Maybe shorten the whiskers by a few pixels, make the tail a bit thinner and maybe shrink her front paws and her right (her right) back paw a just a little. 16:28, June 9, 2013 (UTC)

The bottom of the tail on <--- this side looks like it has an extra line on it, the front part of the belly (or chest?) doesn't look like it connects to the belly smoothly, and the shape of the paws look...off? to me. I don't really know how to explain it, but something about the digits on the paws seem to be throwing me off. 00:49, June 11, 2013 (UTC)

Still working, Berry? 18:28, June 13, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Yes- sorry for the lack of re-uploads, I've not had access to a computer. The line on the tail, Ivy, is a bit of fur and I'll keep it unless someone else says otherwise. and the Hannibal eyes stay eheheheh 07:35 Fri Jun 14

Possibly smoothen the lineart on the back? (there's like a little place where it rises :P) 12:21, June 14, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded 04:08 Sat Jun 15

Smooth out the hind food and make the actual part that touches the ground smaller and less bulbous. 4:14 Sat Jun 15 2013

Re-uploaded 04:17 Sat Jun 15

Thin the tail more. 10:22, June 15, 2013 (UTC)

I'd like to keep the tail as it is unless someone else agrees. 14:33 Sat Jun 15

Can you make the legs and paws a bit thinner too? 15:40, June 15, 2013 (UTC)

I honestly think it's fine. 16:18, June 15, 2013 (UTC)

Can you taper the end of the tail a bit more at the tip and the lifted paw looks a little too splayed 00:28, June 16, 2013 (UTC)

I agree with Sorrel. If you think about a real cat, the tail gets thinner at the tip. It does not look that way now - and these are the short-hair blanks after all. I do not want to sound rude. Please don't shoot me! 02:26, June 16, 2013 (UTC)

Shorten whiskers by a few pixels? 18:44, June 16, 2013 (UTC)

Could you smooth out the hind paw just a tad and thin out the tail like Hawk and Sorrel said? Other than that, these are honestly fine. Thistleflight (talk) 22:51, June 18, 2013 (UTC)

Could you please remove the dots above the head? It's a style thing and doesn't go with the style of any of the blanks we have. And yes, I agree the tail need to be thinned out a ton. It's almost thicker than the legs right now. Make the dew claw stick out less on the front paw, and make the back paw a more defined shape rather than a really smooth kinda soft line that makes it look too round and blobby. Shrink the paws quite a bit too, they're much too big for a cat in comparison to the leg size. Clean up the whisker lineart so it's a bit smoother, and maybe vary the lengths of the whiskers. Lastly, the chest is in front of the legs, so at this angle, the line for the chest should go over the far front leg, rather than the line that shows the leg connecting with the body being in front. Honestly, I thought it was mostly fine before and only needed a few minor tweaks, but... :/

Re-uploaded I tried a thing with the front paw but I can change it back if needed. I had issues with the hind paw...a lot of issues. e.e 10:39 Wed Jun 19

Her front paw that's on the ground is bigger then the others. 14:29, June 19, 2013 (UTC)

Her back right paw looks as if it is pointing outward, could you possibly make it so it looks like we're looking at it straight on? Those paws look great already, but if you need a little reference, I found this. Also, on the base of her tail, there's just a little stray line there. And last, could you make that line on the back of her foreleg on her shoulder (one that is lifting up the paw off the ground) straight instead of curving in? <span style="">19:30 Thu Jun 20

The front left leg could be curved a tad more. Also, the lifted front paw should be curved more as well. Also, I find that the queen looks a little scrawny. I hate to sound rude, but honestly, I liked it better the way you had it before, but... x-x 00:35, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

There's some pixels on the part where the (our left) part of her tail meets her body, and they look a bit odd. Like Hawk and Paleh, I preferred the version before, but this is good all the same. 01:45, June 23, 2013 (UTC)

Er, yeah, like Sorrel and Hawk, I liked the ones you made before (your first ones better, I don't want to sound rude). Maybe upload it back and just curve the front paw justa scinch.Thistleflight (talk) 21:57, June 24, 2013 (UTC)

Okay guys I can see you're all hinting at it, but do you want me to just go ahead and bring back the ones I had before and change what's been told? sighs because I much prefer these but I guess majority rules <span style="">06:44 Tue Jun 25 06:44, June 25, 2013 (UTC)

Uh, yes, you really should put the original blanks back. Maybe with a few minor adjustments, though. Thistleflight (talk) 22:34, June 25, 2013 (UTC)

Well I think it'd be easier on your side with what changes will need to be made to fit style and anatomy with the old blanks. Of course they'd still need a couple tweaks, but I think it'd be easier overall for you. These are still good though, and it's ultimately up to you I believe.

Reverting back to the "original" blanks may be a bit more drastic than need be, especially since you'd basically loose all that progress of getting some aspects of the anatomy, as it is currently, looking well done. Maybe overlay the original and the current version and figure out any extremities that might need fixing with reference from Raelic's redline like the forepaws and the tilt to the back paws. Good job, Berry. 22:55, June 25, 2013 (UTC)

I think you should change back. I'm sure other users would be *Dives behind brick wall* okay  with the decision. It matches the other linearts much better and, like Paleh said, would only need a few more tweaks. Great job on everything Berry! 23:18, June 25, 2013 (UTC)

I do believe Berry gets the point of multiple users preferring her original blanks. I ask that if you're going to comment on the blanks, please comment on what she has uploaded, as the message of a majority of users wanting the other blanks back has very easily been proven. Seriously guys, enough already; she gets the point.

Agreeing with what Cloudy said above; these are the blanks that she has uploaded. Berry prefers these blanks and these are hers to work with and manage. We've already put a lot of effort on these blanks to make them the way they are now, and it seems almost like a waste of that effort to go right back. Both blank styles are beautiful, but like Cloudy said, these are the ones uploaded, and the ones we should be sticking with. I like these ones we have now, but right now isn't the place for opinions, I believe. <span style="">03:06 Mon Jul 1

I'm actually having a lot of trouble with the anatomy on these blanks, combining the older with the newer ones and stuff. If anyone could offer up a redline, it would be hugely appreciated. <span style="">11:06 Wed Jul 3

Here. I tried, seriously. It may not be that amazing but I tried. 16:58, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded Okay so I found the image I used as a ref for the original blanks and messed around I know it sucks plz don't rub it in. <span style="">05:17 Mon Jul 8

She looks... rather stocky and muscly. Flatten the shoulder and back so they don't rise so much. Add toes to the paw that's off the ground. 20:37, July 8, 2013 (UTC)

Lengthen the shoulder a bit where it meets their back. These are fantastic, Berry! Thistleflight (talk) 21:31, July 8, 2013 (UTC)

In the picture I referenced this from, that is how the back and shoulder look. The way th lifted paw is raised, as well, would make no toes visible, and if they were the paw would look crooked. I'd rather not touch these thing unless someone else agrees. <span style="">04:40 Tue Jul 9

I was going to do this pose as well when I entered, but I saw you used it already. Referencing back to the original image, I'd say the shoulder should end just above the tip of the right ear (the cat's right, /not/ our's), and the lifted hind paw should have two toes visible, so one toeline should be on it. Berry, these are wonderful ^-^ <span style="">23:55, 07/9/2013

Re-uploaded <span style="">04:54 Wed Jul 10

No I really agree the toes should be defined on the front paw that's off the ground. For them not to be visible at all, the toes would have to be really curled, which isn't very natural. They wouldn't be super defined in this position, but they'd be very clearly visible.

The lineart looks choppy in places, could you smoothen it out a bit? One way to do this is add a few pixils to the edges where it curves and it gives the illusion of smoothness  21:08, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

Also, now that I have a bit more time to comment, the shoulder of the paw on the ground is much too defined and large right now, and the place where it connects to the head is lined up in a way that it doesn't look connected to the actual leg. Try and follow the curve of where the lines would be if they were visible. The front paw that's on the ground also looks a bit twisted with that extra line on our left side. I'm not sure if that's the dew claw or a line to try and define the paw some more. If it's the dew claw, make it stick out a bit from the leg, so it appears more like an actual toe that has mass to it. The chest needs to follow the curve of the belly more, and as I said before, the chest would be in front of our right front leg at this angle. The place the elbow connects to the body shouldn't be visible. Try and thin out the haunch a bit, as she's starting to look a bit just overall chubby rather than pregnant. Our right back leg seems to both be oddly positioned (too high and too far to our left) and doesn't quite look clearly like a paw. It looks more like the bend in the leg right now, but nothing goes past the bent front foot that would show. Try and make the tail a bit more of a consistent thickness, only getting slightly thinner at the tip, and overall just slim it down a bit. Also, the eyes look a bit odd right now, like they don't quite match the way the other was drawn (trust me, I know what a pain they can be x.x), try and pick either one of them and make the other eye match a bit better. I do believe with cats, the back leg doesn't have a dew claw, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. If I'm not, please remove that. And try and make the shape of the back paw curve with where the toes would be, rather than just a random kind of "guessed" curve with toes added in. That's a bit hard for me to explain, and if it doesn't make sense I can redline that part. And finally, the whiskers still look kind of choppy and just not very smooth at all, try and smooth them out.

The bridge of the nose seems a little thick and straight and is throwing off the nose. The nose doesn't really look like a cat's nose, it looks more like a triangle. The muzzle needs to be smoothed out more, and the eyes' lineart seems to be choppy in places. Also, the front left (our right) leg looks like it bending in a bunch of directions and the lineart is choppy. The face sort of reminds me of one of my grade-school bus-drivers. *shudders*  21:22, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah gonna be away til Thursday so I'll upload then. <span style="">22:35 Mon Jul 15

I'm not trying to sound mean or anything but it has been 19 days since you reuploaded and 14 days since you said that you would update this, so I have to inquire if you're still working on this? 16:34, July 29, 2013 (UTC)

I am, but I'm having a lot of trouble with them. I don't know if anyone would perhaps be able to offer up a redline, because I'm seriously lost. <span style="">12:00 Wed Jul 31

Redlinin' it up~ Hope this helps <span style="">00:43, 08/1/2013


 * Yeah, don't use ^^that one, I forgot stuff. Use this one. I seriously hope this helps, but since I know almost nothing of the anatomy of a cat, this is the best I could do to help c: <span style="">19:19, 08/1/2013

Re-uploaded <span style="">06:05 Sat Aug 3

Where did her eye pupils go? 10:50, August 3, 2013 (UTC)

Make the thigh less flat. Also, >>>this front leg seems to be very thick, also can you curve it more? The tail seems a bit...lumpy. 13:13, August 3, 2013 (UTC)

The lifted forepaw looks a bit small compared to the body and define the toes on it 01:58, August 5, 2013 (UTC)

I don't really like the way how sharply < this back leg curves. Perhaps lighten the curve? And also, the tail look a little thick for a short-haired queen, so if you could thin that a little, that'd be great. 12:26, August 5, 2013 (UTC)

I think the lineart looks rather thick in places. 17:33, August 5, 2013 (UTC)

The face looks lumpy. Make the thigh rounder. 01:10, August 6, 2013 (UTC)

Still working? 20:03, August 9, 2013 (UTC)

Front --> leg is a little thick and straight. And as for the thickness, a lineart width of 2 pixels would look best. Wow, good job! <span style="">08:19 Sat Aug 10

Oh yeah, and shorthair tails don't taper or grow thicker. They sort of stay the same from base to tip, except the tip is normally like, rounded at the tip. <span style="">17:24 Sat Aug 10

Yes, still working, but I've not had much of a chance to use a computer the past few days. I'll upload about Monday (for me, about Sunday-ish for you guys.) <span style="">08:34 Sat Aug 10

I suggest curving the tail a bit more at the top, and readjusting the tail lineart to go along side with it, so that it's easier to deal with. Just a suggestion, though. 00:52, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

re-uploaded look, I'm sorry guys but I've just been so busy and I just feel like crap. Added to that shitloads of homework and constant teasing and nonstop name-calling and you get a very distracted Berry who is about to break. <span style="">07:13 Mon Aug 19

The back paw looks unnatural. Maybe just smooth out the back paw a little bit. Dewfire (talk) 04:27, August 21, 2013 (UTC)

In the back on the <--- paw, there's a stub. I'm not sure what it is, but I think you should get rid of it. <font color="#33A1DE" face="Century Gothic" size="2"> •Wanty• <font color="#99A3AE" face="flat brush" size="2">That's fine too! 20:47, August 22, 2013 (UTC)

Hm, maybe make the tail more curvy at the tip and curve this <--- hind paw a bit. 18:33, August 24, 2013 (UTC)

Oh, the face face looks choppy in some places and smooth out this <--- hind paw a bit. 18:35, August 24, 2013 (UTC)

It's okay berry, everyone has times in their life where things suck, take your time. The wrist area (or whatever) on the right front paw looks a bit thin, but slightly in an unnatural way. Can you make it thicker?

The tail is still shaped unnaturally... I'm sorry ;.; Just remember life has its ups and downs, and right on this screen you've got a whole society full of understanding leads and lowerclass users who respect you and admire your talent. Stay strong Berry :3 <span style="">03:57 Tue Aug 27

Oh and, I wanted to use your blanks in a personal image and tweaked the lineart for anatomical purposes. Link is here. Play around with the opacities and colors to help you make the blanks. hope this helps :3 <span style="">04:33 Tue Aug 27

The back right (their left) hind leg is in an awkward position, and the face is much too round. I hate to say this but face on your very first version were one of my favorites. The chest is kind of awkward, and the left foreleg (our right) should be curved a tad, and it is too large. The paws are too square, and the tail needs to be smoothed out. The bridge of the nose should be curved a bit more and the eyes should be more oval shaped. The ears are on an awkward angle. The right (our left) whiskers need to be made longer. 22:21, August 28, 2013 (UTC)

The paws look blobby and maybe make the nose more realistic like a cat's and instead of a basic triangle. 20:32, August 30, 2013 (UTC)

I feel really bad about saying this, Berry, but you've been working on this for over 3 months now and I feel like you still haven't made a sufficient amount of improvement, and that lately you haven't been very active. I really, really love these blanks, im so sorry ;.; School and especially bullying is really hard to cope with, but I feel like it's for the good of the project. ;.; <span style="">04:34 Tue Sep 3

It's not entirely her fault she's without a computer sometimes. Regardless, it will be discussed, I guess, as to what should be done with the blanks. While I don't mind letting Berry keep them, that's just my opinion. What say you, guys? The opinions of two are not the entire project consensus, mind you.

I think we should let Berry continue to work on them. Like you said, Cloudy, it's not her fault she's without a computer at times, and so far, she's done a great job with the blanks. Instead, in the chat didn't we go through this discussion that for making new blanks they can have as much time as they want/need? And her school isn't helping either, by the sound of it. I think we should let her continue to work, and give her comfort in her time of need right now. So yeah, I believe we should let her continue to work on them. Love you, Berry <3 c: 12:57, September 5, 2013 (UTC)

I agree with Raven. Berry has done a terrific job with these blanks so far, and it isn't her fault she does not have computer access 100% of the time. She should be allowed longer to work on them. 14:33, September 5, 2013 (UTC)

I also agree that Berry ought to have more time on these blanks. I myself am beginning to really taste how busy life can get. Also, by the way, could you link us to your reference photo, Berry, if you have one? I just want to see the layout of the pose we are capturing with this blank, and I'd be happy to make another redline for you if you need it. 19:54, September 7, 2013 (UTC)

So long as Berry shows continued interest in making these blanks, she should get to continue working on them, the project did the same for me when it took half of a year. 06:09, September 8, 2013 (UTC)

This is the image I used for the original blanks. I'd hugely appreciate a redline, thank you. I'm going to try and reupload asap after I get this redline. I'm sorry, I'm taking so long with these, I feel bad I'm making you all wait, but I've got crap going on, high school's tough, it's an effort for me to do anything atm. Again I'm sorry. <span style="">12:59 Mon Sep 9

Hmmm....the tail needs extensive tweaking. It needs to be curved-ish, and the tail could be a little longer. But good job! <span style="padding: 0px 5px 0px 5px; border: Dotted 2px #3EC2FA ; background: #FADD20 ; -moz-border-radius: 0em 0em 0em 0em; -webkit-border-radius: 0em 0em 0em 0em; border-radius: 0em 0em 0em 0em;"> Gingerpetal @she-cat central  StarClan enlightening~  12:43, September 11, 2013 (UTC)

I think the length of the tail is fine, honestly.

The thickness of the legs doesn't seem quite consistant; maybe thicken the lifted foreleg and thin out the one on the ground? Straighten the back of the hind leg, it looks like the bone is twisting under her body. And maybe "pooch out" (in lack of a better comparison) the haunch/flank a bit more. 04:16, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

Hmm. Lemme see if I can make a redline for you. 19:45, September 16, 2013 (UTC)

Maybe try these? I could only manage the tail, paws and a bit of the eye; I couldn't really manage the face. 21:05, September 16, 2013 (UTC)

The cat's front right leg looks a little skinny next to the cat, and the front left leg seems a little too straight. Other than that, wonderful job! Emberpoppy (talk) 01:12, September 18, 2013 (UTC)

Here is the redline. I deeply apologize for being so late; lots of homework and I haven't been looking around the project pages as much as I should. As for that back leg on <-- this side, I made it straight because it is a bit simpler to sketch the leg like that. Again, sorry, hope this helps out. 02:27, September 18, 2013 (UTC)

Alright, so Berry has told me that I can take these over. Reuploaded. Comment away, friends. <span style="">18:29, 09/27/2013

The head and body look rather large compared to her tail and legs. Maybe shrink them a bit? 20:56, September 27, 2013 (UTC)

If you don't mind me saying this Ferk, but can you tweak the face? To me, it does not look "female-enough" and looks a tad chubby. Also, the bridge of the nose can be curved more. The nose looks unnatural, and maybe make the shoulder of the lifted paw larger? Also, could you maybe make the front leg on the ground curved a tad. I love the tail and the paws. Great job! 22:28, September 27, 2013 (UTC)

Ferk, if you could, do you mind telling me where Berry gave you permission to take over her blanks? Like, was it in chat or something? I believe you and all, but I just wanted to have it said somewhere on the wiki that you do in fact have her permission to take over, that way no one can accuse you of trying to steal the blanks from her and all of that fun stuff that comes with it.


 * It's okay, Skye, I gave her permission in chat. I'd been thinking of withdrawing them and Ferk offered to take them over. ^_^ <span style="">05:22 Sat Sep 28

define the paw "shape" of the back <-- paw? Sorry for being unclear... lol that tail is so hard to work with, good job! ^-^ <span style="">04:44 Thu Oct 3

Reuploaded. <span style="">20:57, 10/4/2013

This is amazing! I love the face! It looks so..delicate. c: Maybe you could smooth out the belly a bit more? It looks a bit lumpy. And at that stance, it would hang down in almost a perfect sphere. [In some cases. In others, like depending how long the cat has been pregnant, it would probably hang down differently. :3 ] Keep up the good work, Ferk! Hey that rhymes! xD 12:24, October 5, 2013 (UTC)

Maybe push together the whiskers hanging off the face on the right side, and make the, er, place where the claw comes out of, aka here on this epic cat, longer and curve it a bit more. This is amazing, Imma lovin the tail! &#9786;      Ⓐ   Ⓜ  Ⓑ  Ⓔ  Ⓡ    Ⓢ Ⓗ Ⓘ  Ⓝ  Ⓔ    Hope  comes  with  FLYING OREOS <span style="">16:48 Mon Oct 7

I think you mean the dew claw c: but if it's not I swear to god I'll have a go at Katryn Lasky. She said in one of her books that it's called a dew claw, but she makes up so many words in her series. Anywho, Maybe flatten the lower part of her back and the back of neck (I think) a bit? They look like camel humps x3 Nice job so far! 18:04, October 8, 2013 (UTC)

To add on to what Ravenfrost said, it's not that it's "lumpy", so to say... but it curves a little awkwardly. I don't know exactly where it would curve, but perhaps smooth it out? I apologize I'm not good with anatomy.

^ Yes, what Cloudy said, was what I was trying to say. Don't beat yourself up, I'm not good with words either. ;) 23:56, October 8, 2013 (UTC)

The slope of the chest from her front left paw is a little awkward, maybe smooth it out a bit? Emberpoppy7 (talk) 20:08, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Enlarge the shoulder of the paw that's off the ground. 20:56, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

The front paw on the ground, looks like she's walking on the side of her foot, enlarge and tilt? Wow, this is amazing! and btw, Ember, you stated what was argued exactly above, please don't repeat comments :). <span style="">00:45 Thu Oct 10

Blizzardwing (A) ~ For Approval
ew what have I created if changes aren't showing  <span style="">07:01 Thu Aug 8

What are you talking about? This is incredible, Berry! I wish I could do charart like this. Lighten the mottles a tad. 14:25, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

The color seems to not be the same as in the warrior image, I don't know if that's the shading or not though. If it's just the shading then that's fine, just lighten it then 19:14, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

No offense Berry, but pay you please stop saying your images are bad >.<'. It sounds like you're fishing for compliments x.x/shot Smudge mottles more. There needs to be more too. Lessen the tint and smudge the shading more. <span style="">22:00 Thu Aug 8

Blur the shading on the face? It looks like a gray patch of fur right now. 00:42, August 9, 2013 (UTC)

Think you could change the tint of the shading to the cyan it is on the warrior? It'll make the colors match a lot more. (I don't know if I'm repeating Ivy or not, sorry. ^^;) <span style="">6:17 Sat Aug 10 2013

I think that the mottles need to be more circular and kinda creamish color (sorry if this doesn't make any sense DX)

Still working? 00:52, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

Yes, still working. I've had a hectic week- a crap load of homework plus constant reading up of subject selection advice has led to me having no time on a computer at all. I'll uploaded Blizzardpaw and the queens tomorrow, as it'll be Friday and I'll actually not have anything mandatory to read by the next day. school sucks especially subject selection x.x <span style="">12:45 Thu Aug 15

Sorry, Berry, but I have to decline since it's been more than a week without uploads ;u; gah im sorry  04:06, August 19, 2013 (UTC)

Re-posted o3o <span style="">11:30 Mon Aug 19

Sorry but it's been way too long. If you were allowed to do that anybody would be. This is declined; you can post again in a week or so. Sorry Berry. <span style="">12:54 Mon Aug 19 2013

No, actually, the limit only applies to images that are declined due to the one month limit. Berry is more than allowed to repost her image should she wish. ouo

I'm a little bit confused here. Images are often declined due to a lack of work, which is caused by not uploading within a week of the last upload. I understand life is first, and I get the whole butload of homework predicament. It happens to me too often. But a rule is a rule, and I don't understand why it wouldn't apply here as so many other images have been declined due to that in the past. If you could clarify that just a little bit more as to why, that'd be great. 02:02, August 20, 2013 (UTC)

The one month thing is how long the charart is able to stay up for, period. The one week limit is how long a user has to reupload their charart before it gets declined. I also agree with Knight and Breezy, so this will have to stay declined. 20:18, August 21, 2013 (UTC)

Uh, no, you're missing my point? Berry is allowed to repost her image. The two week "wait period" before she's allowed to repost would only apply if she got it declined due to the month limit. I wasn't giving her leeway or anything, but letting her use the same section as to not spam the approval page. She's more than welcome to reupload and repost, and it's not breaking any rule whatsoever. Breezey told her that she could repost in a week or so, and that's not technically correct, but I guess that could be explained by the lack of consistency in parts of the guidelines. I think you guys are totally missing why I changed the heading. o.O

-Sorry for butting into the convo- But would it be possible if I like, copied this image right now, and continued working on it for Berry? And kept fixing what needed to be fixed? -I'd fixed what you all asked right now, of course- But I have not practiced this pattern yet, and it would be great experience for me to look at Berry's AMAZING work. So is that possible? [I will reserve it once someone replies] 11:52, August 22, 2013 (UTC)


 * The issue I have is that Berry should not be allowed to post it again after it's been declined as it would undermine the entirety of declining due to lack of work. If users are allowed to "repost" their image after a seven day period, then keeping it reserved and "reposting" would also be allowed, which would conflict with the reservation time limit as well. Declining an image due to lack of work and having a hands-off period for said user would be a less conflicting course of action than to allow Berry to repost it. There are two points, and right now, we're focusing on the one that allows Berry to repost it, not the topic of application.


 * As for your comment, Darkfrost, you must start it from scratch otherwise it would be image theft and editing. The only situation that barely passes as exception to that rule is tweaking and redoing because it has consent of the project's community consensus. You're welcome to redo the entire image though if this is declined. 21:13, August 22, 2013 (UTC)

Understood, 'teldy. I'll reserve it now. I'll have it up either tonight or tomorrow. c: 22:44, August 22, 2013 (UTC)

Uploaded. Oh. My. Goodness. I was lucky to have this look so good -_- apparently mottles are tough for me. I tried to match the warrior as best as I could, and to my surprise they sorta do. If anyone like Raelic for examp. is really good at mottles, please leave a message on my talk page to tell me how to do them well. It would be very appreciated. But yeah, tried to match the warrior as best as I could. Comments? 01:35, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Define the eye depth, define the tail shading, and make the earpink match the warrior. 03:03, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Can you make the dark gray mottles small and add more of them to match the warrior? ^^  03:14, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Hmm..Misty may be talking about the shading, since its practically the color of the mottles, making them blend. Eh, do what she said. 12:21, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

No, she's not. She means the mottles. Where did she mention shading? 12:29, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Sorrel, no need to get snippy with her. She's having a hard life right now. And anyway, yes Raven I saw your point, and I changed the tint slightly so it doesn't blend as much. Added more dark gray mottles and tried to make them smaller, but I didn't want to mess up the pattern. Defined the eye depth, tail shading, and I matched the ear pink with the warrior's. Matched them side by side and they look like they match, but then again, I'm not that much of an expert x3 13:16, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

I wasn't being snippy. I was just saying, Misty said nothing about shading. 14:35, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Make the mottles match more. This is great~ ^^ 19:17, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

The earpink on this ---> side looks a little small  19:22, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Thanks Hawky:)Hope this was what you guys were looking for. o3o And yes, Sorrel, I understand. She was trying to say that the shading blended in with the dark gray mottles, making them look large, like Misty was talking about. Sorry if she caused confusion. c: 22:24, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Yes, that's what I meant..Sorry Sorrel. 22:55, August 23, 2013 (UTC)

Could you define/darken the shading, especially on the midsection of the cat? I like this. :) 21:58, August 24, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Thanks, Knight! :D And I won't be able to upload until Friday, since I'm going tent camping to Michigan today[Ravenfrost is coming with, view the vacation list if there is any confusion] and I'll have no internet. So, I'll try to upload either Friday, or Thursday[late in day] but that might not happen. Seeya~ ^_^ 12:14, August 26, 2013 (UTC)

The shading doesn't seem to have the same tint than the warrior. Can you fix that? ^^  06:40, August 27, 2013 (UTC)

Tint looks fine, but maybe saturate a bit then lessen the opacity? The mottles are getting lost. This looks amazing, especially considering this is so much harder when you try to do it. <span style="">21:01 Tue Aug 27

Re-uploaded. Thanks, Kelpsey. c: You're right, it was quite a challenge, and whoever did the warrior image of Blizzardwing, I hold her(or him) in great respect. ^_^ Had a fun Vacation btw, and I need some much needed sleep.. 20:50, August 29, 2013 (UTC)

Define exactly where the shading is. The tint, darkness, and overall position is fine, I'd say, but it appears to be somewhat flat, and I have to squint to see it. I also think the mottles could match a tad more, but I'm not sure how to explain matching them, as I didn't make the warrior image, and I'm not all that good with mottles. Perhaps someone else could come along and provide a better explanation than I can?

Re-uploaded. I defined where the shading was. And trust me, I'm not that good with mottles at all. But with some patience, and time, I got close..Yet, paring the two side by side, it turns out they match up pretty well: Clik Meh 22:22, August 30, 2013 (UTC)

Hmm... in general, yes, they do, it would seem. Although these seem like they don't quite go with the flow of the fur, although that could be my eyes. Maybe get another opinion on that first, as my eyes have never been good with that sort of thing.

Understood. 12:52, August 31, 2013 (UTC)

Also, I found out A Beautiful Oblivion [Oblivion] did the warrior image, so I'll try to get in contact with her. c: 12:58, August 31, 2013 (UTC)

^ I decided that I didn't know her schedule, or when she's on, and I've never met her. So until she comes on chat, when I'm on, I won't bother her. So, it has been a full 4 days since an upload, so may I drag some comments or perhaps a CBA? c: 12:12, September 2, 2013 (UTC)

Oblivion isn't usually on; however, she's active on tumblr, I believe. 12:33, September 2, 2013 (UTC)

Define the shading and light source; I can't see one. 14:33, September 2, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. I made it like Cloudy's Tawnypelt apprentice alt. Better? c: And yeah, I'll check it out, thanks Sorrel. :D 13:45, September 3, 2013 (UTC)

I think you should define the shading just a bit more and then blur it. Otherwise, looking good! 18:16, 9/3/13

I agree with defining the shading, but blurring it will defeat the purpose. Maybe just define the shading and also darken it only? 04:50, September 5, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. 12:10, September 5, 2013 (UTC)

Could you make the shading less gray, or make the mottles match more? Also, blur the shading some more. 18:29, September 8, 2013 (UTC)

Could you maybe extend the belly shading all the way up to the chin? It just kind of stops at the belly. <span style="">23:20 Mon Sep 9

Excellent job! Fix shading please. <span style="padding: 0px 5px 0px 5px; border: Dotted 2px #3EC2FA ; background: #FADD20 ; -moz-border-radius: 0em 0em 0em 0em; -webkit-border-radius: 0em 0em 0em 0em; border-radius: 0em 0em 0em 0em;"> Gingerpetal @she-cat central  StarClan enlightening~  12:51, September 11, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Thanks Ginger. But I can't do anything to my image when you just say "fix shading." Please say what you want me to fix about it. Okay, I made the shading less gray, blurred it more, but the mottles match fine imho. And I extended the belly shading up to the neck shading. Hope this was what you guys were looking for.. 12:06, September 12, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. I hated the shading, so I changed it. I have no idea how to shade an apprentice..so if I should shade or unshade something, lemme know.

Blur and maybe lighten up the shading a bit? This is coming along nicely.c: 15:24, September 12, 2013 (UTC)

The mottles and shading appear to "merge", in a sense, with each other. Are your mottles and shading the same color? If so, perhaps try tinting the shading a bit more so the mottles don't disappear within the shading. Withdrawing, Ravenfrost is taking over so I can take back Meadowslip. 14:46, September 16, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. After Frosty's extremely patient tutorial on how to do her copy of Blizzardpaw, I made this. xD I've been practicing mottles, though, so I hope this came out well. I did my very best to take all the colors from the Blizzardwing, I tried to match the texture of white on the face, I tried to match the mottles, by taking the colors. I tried to match the tint of the shading, so if it need to be more blue, let me know. c: Comments? 15:25, September 16, 2013 (UTC)

Could you darken the shading just a little bit? It's a bit hard to note that the shading is there, and that should clear it up a bit. Nice! 01:42, September 18, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Thank you! c: 14:16, September 19, 2013 (UTC)

Could you blur the head shading and the stomach shading? Right now they look like it's a dark stripe. 22:42, September 19, 2013 (UTC)

Also perhaps the shading along the haunch? 00:18, September 20, 2013 (UTC) Shadewing

The mottles still appear to get lost in the shading... I'll ask the same thing I did for Darkfrost. Are your mottles and shading the same color? If they are, perhaps slightly change the color of one of them so they don't merge, in a sense. Like, where the shading appears to be the most prominent, this is where I also lose sight of the mottles. The same goes especially for the underbelly.

Re-uploaded. I made sure the mottles didn't get lost in the shading, since I figured out the color of Blizzardwing's tint. You can now see through the shading. Better? c: 03:19, September 20, 2013 (UTC)

Where us your light source? According to the tail, it's coming from <<<this side, but according to the shoulder, it's comming from this>>> side. Please define the light source and decide which side the light is coming from. 16:32, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

There's no shading on the shoulder. o.o Those are mottles. But I'll blur them some I guess, since they're being mistaken for shading.. 21:12, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

I think you should sharpen the mottles a tad, not blur them, because if they're overblurred they won't match the warrior. If there isn't shading on the shoulder (however from what I'm looking at, it seems like there is), there probably should be or else it will be inconsistent. Make sure that the shoulder and upper leg shading are placed on the right, not on the left (as that's what where it's being placed now), as the tail shading is placed on the right. It's coming along well!

Understood, and thanks! But I've seen Cloudy shade her apprentices just like this []. And I took a look at the shoulder, and I guess it is shading. :/ I only tried to match her shading from this image. So tell me, what should I do? If this image got approved with that certain light source, why should I change mine? 16:14, September 23, 2013 (UTC)

Just because I do it doesn't make it okay. .-. I shade like that because I still don't have a full understanding of light sources on some of the blanks, the apprentice blanks being the worst of them. I have said this time and time again, and it's one of the major reasons I do not mentor anyone for PCA: do not copy my shading; it's hardly ever correct. Mine was approved because the other leads thought it was good enough to be placed on the article. And even then, each image is evaluated individually, so copying another user's style doesn't mean that much, unless it's referring to the stripes, mottles, ect. Shading is something entirely different.

Understood. I'll have it up later tonight. 18:17, September 23, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. 23:13, September 23, 2013 (UTC)

Blur the haunch shading (the piece connecting the back to the haunch, I mean) and define the unshaded parts on his back paw? (one closest to us)  03:02, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. 11:41, September 26, 2013 (UTC)

Could you smooth out the belly shading just a little bit? It looks great! <span style="">18:38 Sun Sep 29

Re-uploaded. Thanks, Splook! c: 17:39, September 30, 2013 (UTC)

Compared to the warrior, he seems a tad too dark... Hmm... Also, define the shading on all four legs. Keep in mind that define does not mean darken; it means make it more visible.

erase some shading off the back --> paw? this has improved so much, good job! have i sent you the email tutorial yet? i cant really remember wheter i did or not <span style="">04:48 Thu Oct 3

Re-uploaded. Sorry, I couldn't upload it for a few days, I was busy. .-. But I hope that satisfied your request, Cloudy. c: And Kel, I think it's fine the way I shaded it, since this lightsource would require it to be fully shaded. And I haven't checked xD I'll go check now, if you didn't I'll comment on you're talk. But guys, I'd appreciate more comments. Slam out everything you see currently that needs to be fixed, because I want to get this approved. Thanks. 11:35, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

ohmygodshe'salive Heyo, I thought I'd just help you out a little bit. So, I'll try and explain what I did because I'm looking at my layers now and there's a lot of them. First layer is the solid base colour, which is just pure, solid white. On top of that is my own specific style of fur texturing, which is really complicated but basically it's a very very pale grey fur texture. Next is a layer of mottles (colour #ebecbf which should turn out as a pale yellow) on a 75% opacity and multiplied. Overtop is another layer of mottles (colour #c6c7c7 which should turn out as pale grey), also on multiply but 100% opacity. There is a whole lot of shading layers, but the shading is basically a dark bluey-green, colour #1a3952, and then there are two highlight layers, one colour #feffa0 and the other white. The white highlights are only on his nose, chest, and the top of his tail. I hope this helps! 00:26, October 4, 2013 (UTC)

lo and behold, the wonderfully rumored ancient artist Loonie! Aren't the eyes supposed to be green? and I think I actually did send it! Lol did I? <span style="">04:02 Fri Oct 4

Wow, you don't know how much I needed that. Thank you so much, Oblivion! I'll get crackin' on it soon. I'll see if I can make it come out close. Your image is so beautiful! c: I'd also like to get to know you more if possible, all of your images are absolutely stunning. And Kel, I color picked from Blizzardwing's eyes. They're supposed to be blue. And I checked, like the other day, and I had no new messages from you. I'll check again, but you may have to re-send it. :| 19:58, October 4, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Re-did it with Oblivion's colors. Thanks again! c: 20:52, October 4, 2013 (UTC)

Turns out I didn't send it, lol! It should be there now. Sorry about that! <span style="">17:37 Sun Oct 6

Lol okay I'll check. And, may I ask for comments? 20:49, October 6, 2013 (UTC)

Define the shading on the legs, especially the back two. Not both legs near the back of the cat, near the tail... but back of the image. Which means this one and this one. Yes I screencapped it but that's because I can't explain worth a damn. They both appear flat and although both are in darkness, I think it would vary a bit depending on where.

That was my fear. Okay, I'll get cracking on it later tonight. 11:58, October 7, 2013 (UTC)

The ear pink doesn't completely match the warriors. This is amazing with oreos on top. &#9786;      Ⓐ   Ⓜ  Ⓑ  Ⓔ  Ⓡ    Ⓢ Ⓗ Ⓘ  Ⓝ  Ⓔ    Hope  comes  with  FLYING OREOS <span style="">16:10 Mon Oct 7

Re-uploaded. The two back legs are no longer flat, Cloudy. And Amber, I color picked the ear from the warrior..but I'll flip over to Oblivion's talk and ask her to give me the # for the ear pink. I hate earpink.. x.x And thank you. c: 19:45, October 7, 2013 (UTC)

May I ask for comments? 20:23, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

The shading still doesn't seem like it matches Loonie's, in terms of color/tint. Try and blend it a little better, since it appears to be (to me anyways) slightly abrupt. This is moreso on the haunch/upper body areas.. It appears to be slightly grayer than his warrior as well.

Maybe define/add the light on the front and back paws furthest from us, and define it on the face? Looking great, Rave! 20:32, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Thanks, Sorrel! c: 22:17, October 10, 2013 (UTC)

I'm honestly just really lazy and I don't want to open GIMP because it takes forever and a day to open/close, but my earpink is literally just a standard pink (kinda like Donut's armour in RvB if you watch that and if not just Google Image him uvu). Also I'm pretty sure it's on multiply? I usually do that with my earpinks. Hope this helps and if not I'm sorry. But it's looking pretty good!! 22:31, October 10, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. Thanks, Loonie! :D 03:20, October 11, 2013 (UTC)

Red (SD) (Alt Ro) ~ Declined
She has been mentioned as "flame-colored" in SkyClan's Destiny. Comments? 23:36, September 23, 2013 (UTC)

This is awesome! I likey.. c: Define the shading on the front leg closest to us? 23:47, September 23, 2013 (UTC)

'''Re-uploaded. '''Thank you, Raven. ^-^ 00:08, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure she should get this, some flames that I've seen can get quite dark. 00:13, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

But then she has also been mentioned as 'orange'. So if this isn't flame, this could be orange? 00:34, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

In my opinion, orange and ginger are a bit too close for this to be qualified as an alt, especially with her being dark ginger. What does everyone else think? 02:27, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

Flame-colored, not always, is orange. Now when a boy sees it, it'll be orange. But we're mostly girls, here! And since it's a first alt, Hawkeh has her choice about how dark it goes. Which, the pelt color is like a flame. I can see she went a little on the Firestar route, since he was constantly described as "flame-colored." Red was red. xD Orange would call for a different alt, I believe. Since, the two arn't that close when you think about it. In this  picture, you can see the darker orange of the color Hawkeh picked. And in this  one, you can see the brighter, yet you still see the darker shades of the flames. I believe it is artists choice on what color of "flame" they choose. Flame can even be blue. Not only that, but purple. So yeah..xD Long message, but I hope it was worth my time. c: I luv this image<3 12:56, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

Thank you Raven, but I also color picked from Firestar, so it should be flame. And this isn't the orange, it's the flame-colored. 21:02, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

I honestly believe that they are too close together to warrant an alt. Orange is close to red, and when making a red cat, we don't make them very red in the first place since a true red cat is impossible. While the descriptions of cats may be impossible, I've never read about an unrealistically colored cat. For example, we call Russian Blue and Chartrueses blue, they really are a specific shade of gray that have a blueish tint in certain light, the same for red. In reality, red cats are orange-ginger. My apologies, but I don't think that she should get this alt. 01:37, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

I don't know if I'm repeating Ivy or not (sorry if I am), but flame-colored is basically a brighter variation of ginger/orange, from what I've seen. Go ahead and say if there's such thing as a flame-colored, and I mean actual red cat. Not really. How is a bright ginger different from a ginger? Maybe by a bit, but really it's the same thing. And honestly, raven, I disagree about the color of flame (Again, flame doesn't mean actually flame colored for cats.) It's not artist's choice to make a blue flame-colored cat, as that is nowhere close to realism. I know that being strict on realism isn't such a good idea, imo, but blue flame-colored cats is something that you will see in a fantasy. Personally, I don't think this warrants an alt...

Isn't flame-colored technically a darker ginger anyways? Or at least that's what I was told... And there is no difference, Stoner. For all we know, they could have been simplifying it. I mean, I don't know about you, but if I had to type "the bright ginger tabby she-cat with yellow eyes <insert more of a description>" over and over again, I'd get tired of it. Imagine having to type Spottedleaf's entire description for the amount of times she buts her nose into things? xD I mean, I honestly don't think it's two shades of color apart, which means she might not get the alt. But, that's just me.

Cloudy has a point. And Stoner, you don't have to beat me down on the blue flame, thing. It was an example, not like I was gonna make a blue cat. And it was a little rude when I read over it. Yes, I agree that it would be hard to describe all of Spottedleaf xD Trust me, I am writing some books, and I've had to learn not to put the guy's "whole" description when he's about to speak. Well, if dark ginger and flame colored are the same, then shouldn't Red's current image be tweaked to a more neutural -don't know how you spell that xD- shade of flame? And don't even say flame-colored isn't real. I'll make you a charart of one that looks like flame. I've even got mottles that look like flame. So yeah. ._. I dunno now, you guys are confusing meh xD But yeah, flame is a real color. So, would the original be tweaked? Or would this warrant? :/  11:59, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

It didn't really sound rude to me, Raven. Anywho, back to this: I'm not sure if it warrants or not, as I'm no expert. I would state some improvement but I really don't see anything to improve, as this just stunning. 12:16, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

Well, if you think about it, Firestar is flame colored and he has a red alt, so I'm sure she would warrant this. If he is flame and gets a red, then she is red and gets a flame. Simple as that. And thank you, Sorrel. 20:41, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

She isn't red, she's dark ginger??? 20:52, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

I was being honest and voicing out my opinion, not being rude. At least, it wasn't my intention of course. Maybe to you I was rude, maybe to someone else but that's really a matter of point of view, and sorry if I sounded like it.

Anyways, technically, in the real world, ginger/red/orange is all the same color, all one gene. Every cat is also a tabby, but other genes might cause the markings to be less visible and such. Assuming if the stripes might be less visible, the cat might look bright or lighter. If the tabby stripes are more visible, it maybe will look darker. And not just that, there are many things that can cause ginger to look darker, brighter, ect. Now, about flame-colored... It is not real in cats. Yes, I know about Firestar, but, his description: ginger tom with a flame-colored pelt describes that he is a ginger cat. The 'flame-colored' basically is saying a ginger that looks bright kinda like a flame. He's still a ginger cat. He got the dark red alt because it states dark red, when he's a normal colored cat with a pale belly. The flame refers to bright, imo, not the darkness/lightness of the pelt. So, giving Red an alt, is basically giving a dark ginger cat a slightly brighter version of dark ginger. No much of a point to that.

Sorry about my rambling. I honestly have a big mouth with lots of words. I can't summarize stuff too well. o3o

I forgive you, Stoney. And also, what you are saying makes sense. But still, since you say that dark ginger and red are practically the same color, and Red was described once as a flame colored cat, wouldn't that warrant a tweak for the original image? I have no idea, just throwing that out there. :3   23:35, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think so. The original image is fine.

Actually, I agree with Raven. maybe Red should be tweaked to make her a tad brighter, seen as she has been mentioned as orange/flame-colored. 00:51, September 26, 2013 (UTC)

I disagree with tweaking the original image. Red may have been described as a flame-colored cat once, but one mention when all of her other appearances are simply 'red' shouldn't warrant a thing. 00:58, September 26, 2013 (UTC)

Then, according to what you two are saying, this image warrants as an alt. You guys keep jumping back, and forth, and back, and forth. I'm getting dizzy. x.x Anyway, make up your minds..look at your conversations. They leap from one to another then back, and forth. Flame colored is not in the same category as orange. I'm putting that down once and for all. Whose siding with who? So far, there are only two options. 1. Keep this alt, since this is flame colored. Firestar has a billion alts, and some of the are pretty close to his original color ._. And instead, these two images don't even resemble each other. If I looked at this again have posting this comment, I wouldn't think it was Red. But, when I look at the title, I'll know it's her alt. 2. Tweak the original image. Now don't sue me for saying that again. -_- I'm just trying to get a point out. And I'm sorry if this sounds forced our dragged out, or even rude to some. I'm cranky. x.x I've had no sleep, and need some. Okay, I know you're probably thinking: "No. Why can't we just drop this?" Because: Flame-colored is this image, and this image is her required alt. Yes I'm a talker, too, Stoney. xD  11:34, September 26, 2013 (UTC)

I don't see how those are the only two options? And that second "option" is out of the question, imho. Her image is fine and I don't see any reason as to why it should be tweaked. Plus, that has no place on the PCA Approval Page. Also, she is not red. She is dark ginger. Duck said that and I believe he was completely ignored. Flame-colored is probably a specific shade. As for Firestar, I have no idea why he has some of those alts, nor do I quite care right now, as it has nothing to do with Red and those two have two different descriptions???? Firestar is a ginger cat with a flame colored pelt and Red is dark ginger. Where in the world are you even seeing that she's called a red cat??? It's not in her trivia, nor in her description. If anything, flame colored is a neutral shade, which if it is, she still wouldn't get the alt because it's not two shades of color difference, which was decided upon in the guidelines long before you even joined the wiki, Raven.

Also I should probably say that Firestar was called dark red, not just red, Hawk. There was a specific shade used and that does not go with his description, so I believe that's why he has that. ^^;; Just pointing that out here.

Personally I'm not exactly sure if it should warrant a tweak (I don't think so though...). Anyways really, flame-coloured is not in the same category as orange, but It's kinda because it's not real. A good writer likes to use metaphors and interesting descriptions, so flame-coloured is basically a metaphor for bright. Also, about Firestar, he's also a special occasion, I must point out. He's named for fire even. It's kinda like Tallstar with a very long tail (we don't give every cat a long tail...). So yeah.

May I ask for comments? 20:36, September 30, 2013 (UTC)

Maybe darken the shading on the front leg farthest from us? It looks totally amazing. 22:56, October 1, 2013 (UTC)

Could you maybe smudge the edges of the stripes just a bit so they don't look like they end so abruptly? Also, I think deciding on whether or not she gets the alt in the first place is part of the approval process.

'''Re-uploaded. ''' 00:06, October 2, 2013 (UTC)

I don't believe this warrants an alt because flame-colored is too close to dark ginger, in my mind- flame colored describes a neutral shade of ginger, and dark ginger is only a shade away. 00:53, October 2, 2013 (UTC)

I still agree with Leggo. Two shades is two shades, honestly. It doesn't matter what the term used is.

Okay then. This may be declined if you all wish, and maybe we'll have to take this to discussion whether or not dark-ginger and flame-colored are pretty much the same or not. 20:42, October 4, 2013 (UTC)

Withdrawing since this may be declined. I doubt anyone should take over unless otherwise said. 14:11, October 6, 2013 (UTC)

In case it's not declined, I'll swip this, but if it is, that's fine by me. However, I think this warrants an alt. Flame and ginger aren't exactly the same thing, and can be over two shades apart. 16:28, October 7, 2013 (UTC)

Reups -weeps in sadness- Look here for the changes. It is nothing compared to Hawk's. 20:15, October 7, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think this warrants an alt at all, flame and ginger are way too chose and then from ginger to dark ginger is one shade, so I don't think this warrants it. Also, I don't think that this should be reuploded until a conclusion is reached, if it is it's basically unnecessary uploads and edits. 21:01, October 7, 2013 (UTC)

Kay, I won't re-up unless this is warranted. 21:06, October 7, 2013 (UTC)

I'm still standing by my decision that the alt is unwarranted. Since there appears to be only a couple others that agree, I'll wait a bit before declining this. Or, if another lead wishes, they can do so. However, the table's still open for discussion if anyone wants to talk about it. ^^;

Flame coloured is just red or orange, and either it's calling her orange which is just ginger, or red, but even red itself when it comes to things like hair colour or fur colour actually means a gingery orange colour, but we don't even know what shade it's referring to or anything. I think we should just add it to her description. 07:07, October 8, 2013 (UTC)

All this discussions is doing is repeating that she should not have an alt. If you wish do continue the discussion, take it to the talk page. As is, I am declining it. <span style="">21:09 Wed Oct 9 2013

Mole (Cat) (Star) ~ For Approval
Phew..Wanty, you are one amazing artist to be able to do this. c: Well, I tried my best. c: Comment away! 21:40, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

I think the earpink needs to fill a little more of the ear?

The texture seems to fade when it reaches the shading, and I don't see the light source. Blur the shading and define the pale parts on the rogue. 22:18, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Re-uploaded. My texture looks more amazing then I thought it would. o.o I surprise myself..xD 02:46, October 10, 2013 (UTC)

Could you make the chest texture flow more with the body? 03:43, October 10, 2013 (UTC)

And perhaps smudge it and add different layers of varying intensity? As it is, it doesn't appear to match the rouge slightly. You're on the right path though, and it's getting there. Could you also have the shading flow a little better with the shape of the cat? On the haunch, for example, it appears to be a straight line, when I believe it should curve a little more...

I think I see some waste on the far side on the far ear, and there seem to a few lighter areas at the top part of the tail near the tip. Awesome job, though. 14:00, October 10, 2013 (UTC)

Oooh, the body texture seems closer to the real thing than when I did it. Anyway, the highlights seem to be uneven so can you fix that (make them more even)? Thanks for the compliment. <font color="#33A1DE" face="Century Gothic" size="2"> •Wanty• <font color="#99A3AE" face="flat brush" size="2">That's fine too! 23:13, October 10, 2013 (UTC)