Warriors Wiki talk:Charart

=For Approval= Take it to the approval page

=Tweaked= Take it to the tweak page

=Discussion=

New Proposition
When user a is asked if they're still working on their charart that say, hasn't been uploaded for over five days, they are expected to upload within the next 48 hours. This happens too often without a good reason. Chararts are left up for approval, not worked on, artist is asked if their still working on it, they reply yes, and they don't upload for another week. Honestly, you shouldn't have to be asked if you're still working on your charart unless you were away and unable to bring your computer with you/you don't have internet connection. So, the time limit for chararts without work should be judged from when the artist last uploaded the charart, not the last time they commented that they're still working on the charart. Thoughts? 16:05, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

I agree, this gives others a chance to work on the image if they wish, sounds fair, you want to be here, you have to work. Maple♥ pool  Mischief brewing 16:07, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

Mhmm, I agree also. If you don't work on your image, why bother bein' here? 16:58 Mon Dec 26

I already do this unless someone supplies a decent reason for taking a while. And even then I advise them to hand it off. 23:09, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

I thought this was already the rule, so I agree. Breeze whisker  23:12, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

I agree too. It's fair. If they can't be bothered to help us, we shouldn't be bothered to help them. 23:40, Mon, Dec, 26, 2011

Can we also make it where if a user has to be asked more than twice if they're working on an image (Like, they don't work on it for 6 days, come back and reupload, then don't work on it for another 6 days, and so on) they have their image declined? People shouldn't be able to just upload everytime they get asked that and have no problem. It takes up space, and is just plain annoying honestly. So yeah, just a thought. ♔ⓅⓐⓁⓔⒸⓛⒶⓦ♕  ☆StarClan be with you★  02:32, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I agree. A truly devoted user shouldn't have to be asked even once if they're still working on a charart unless they've given an honest reason to be away. 02:34, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

I agree with Pale and Scarlet above. 05:00, Wed, Dec, 28, 2011

A proposition concerning project vernacular
This is a rather simple proposition concerning one name used in PCA.

I'd like it if Senior Warriors could no longer be called leads.

You see, it may seem like a silly thing to want to change, but here's the reasoning: words are powerful. When a senior warrior is called a lead, it sends the message to new or prospective users that we are in charge, which we are not. We merely have been recognized by the project to have a decent amount of experience, which is reflected in the title of Senior Warrior, and are given the responsibility of approving or declining images. To call us leads is to put us too far above the rest of the project, and as a senior warrior I'm uncomfortable with that.

Comments? 19:30, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

So, do you want there to be no senior warriors at all? I think we just help out the leader and deputy. They can't approve every image or add in every new user all on their own. No, we aren't in charge, but we could shake off the status of being a lead. We'll still be senior warriors and uphold all the responsibilites of being one, but we don't lead the project. I see your point, and I'm open to see what other users have to say. 19:50, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

What gave you the idea that that is what I wanted? No, I just want us to cease being called leads, that's all. 20:01, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

Personally, I don't care either way. But the keystrokes to type "lead" are a whole lot easier than typing "Senior Warrior," which is probably how the term came about. I think it's up to the individual person as to what they prefer to type, but if you mean official guidelines and things like that, I agree that the official term should probably be used to make it sound more...official. Breeze whisker  20:05, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

I strongly disagree. Why? Senior warriors ARE in charge., Not as much as leader or deputy, but they still are high ranks. At first I had a lot more to say but now I'm dead. XP 20:07, December 28, 2011 (UTC)
 * This point of view is both incorrect and outright harmful to the project. The leveled listing of the project was always intended to show experience with the tasks of the project, and to assign extra responsibilities to users. It does not indicate that anyone is in the charge of the project. This is because the Project Members should be leading the project via consensus. Leader, Deputy and Senior Warriors only have extra responsibilities. That's all that sets them apart from the rest of the project. Perhaps it was a mistake on my part to borrow from the books for cutesy names for project membership, as people have an unhealthy tendency to take it too seriously. 16:24, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

You hate me, don't you Shell? Jk. I honestly don't care what SW's are called. Just as long as we have them. 20:10, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

Nah, don't hate anyone. XD But yeah. Senior warrior's aren't in charge, it's arrogant of us to think we are. We're just here to help guide people along and keep the project moving while contributing to it, and that's the extent of it. 20:13, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

I kinda agree with Icy, and at the same time, I don't really care all that much. XD I think we do kinda have a right to be called leads, but I really don't care all that much if that changes. ♔ⓅⓐⓁⓔⒸⓛⒶⓦ♕  ☆StarClan be with you★  00:19, December 29, 2011 (UTC)

I disagree, since it's a whole lot easier just to type leads. Keeping in mind that "lead" technically means "senior warriors, deputy, and leader", it's a whole lot easier to type. You're right Shelly, we're not in charge, but we do possess a higher rank (for lack of a better word) than warriors and apprentices. We have the power to approve or decline images, to decide on CBA, and accept new users into the project. Disclaimer: Remember that in no way are senior warriors better than other users just because we have privileges. 00:35, December 29, 2011 (UTC)

I really don't care either way I never call you guys leads anyway I usually just say SW, so really I don't care. But they are 'leader's' of the project so it makes sense to call them leads. 02:16, December 29, 2011 (UTC)

Actually, SW is a lot easier to type then lead(s). It's just 2 letters! I agree with you Shelly, and I can see why it annoys you. You're not in charge and don't exactly have the right to lead this project. What you do have the rights too and warriors and apprentices can't access, is declining, approving images, CBAing, creating voting forums, etc. Those are the things a leader/deputy would do though, but the only other things leaders/deputies can do that you can't is annoucing new deputies/leaders, and making the final decision for the project. (i probally missed a lot more though.) 23:44, Thu, Dec, 29, 2011

Just a random bit of input from me, concerning another reason the word "lead" shouldn't be used. It's misleading in more ways than just what it implies. It also creates "insider" language that makes the project seem more exclusive and special. It's completely non-intuitive (SW=Senior Warrior is not only intuitive, but a common bit of Warriors Fanon Vernacular). I personally hate the use of the word "lead" by this project.L/D/SW is more descriptive and would at least be intuitive to new members mores than the "Lead". And honestly, why not just type out Leader, Deputy and Senior Warriors. It's not like we pay for bandwidth by the character or anything. Say what you mean, don't use lingo to say what you mean. You could also.. You know... Add the Leader and Deputy to Senior Warrior list (which they technically should be eligible for, anyways, and just use the word SW... It would also save time when a person leaders the Leader or Deputy position in the project, too. 16:20, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

I honestly don't see what the fuss is about, as it's only a word that isn't supposed to be an easier way to type out Senior Warrior/Deputy/Leader, but I'll run with it. How about we call them "Senior Members"? SMs for short? That doesn't seem like it would be difficult to type out, and it doesn't seem completely unintuitive. I dunno. Just a compromise, maybe? 21:58 Sun Jan 1

I'd rather not combine everyone into one category. We're all really not that different, but there should still be a distinguishable line between senior warrior, deputy, and leader. I feel like if we call everyone senior warrior, we're losing what we have as a project. That sounds really stupid, now that I'm reading it again, but I'll stand by it. 00:59, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

I'm not suggesting that we change the rank title. I just suggest that we no longer be called leads, that's all. 01:13, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

I know, Shelly, I was referring to other suggestions. 01:29, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Gone?
I put myself on the vacation list about two weeks ago, and have not been able to put up a more accurate statement of how long I'll be gone... but now my username is not on the project apprentice list. I'm not trying to be annoying, I just don't understand. Can someone please explain what happened? 13:38, December 29, 2011 (UTC)

If you are inactive for two weeks or more, you are automatically removed. If you're more active again I'm sure a lead will add you. 13:40, December 29, 2011 (UTC)

Continuing Discussion
The discussion to develop a screening process has been continued here. I think I've designed a basic structure that will please the project, but I want as many as people as possible to help perfect it. Thank you! 04:13, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Tying Up Lose Ends
Miss me? While I can't say I miss being a member, it's certainly nostolgic being here. I never formally left, but I think it's pretty clear that I'm not around anymore. I don't think I left on the best of terms. Well... I appologize. I don't really know what I'm trying to get at, I guess just an actual goodbye. It's funny to think that it been so long since I joined... almost three years. Oh god my first charart was attrocious, does anyone remember my original version of Spiderleg? I've grown so much as an artist since then, although I'm still not very good. The truth is that I'm just not interested in charart anymore, or Warriors for that matter. I actually came on to read the info for The Forgotten Warrior figuring I might as well see what happens to the cats I've been following since I was a little kid but... Maybe I'll go pick it up next time I'm near the bookstore for old times sake.

Anyway, enough rambling, goodbye you guys. It's been a nice few years. Darkhallows  Enter the cave? 09:32, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Also, why did you guys change the apprentice blanks and not the horrible rogue blanks? xD Darkhallows   Enter the cave? 09:34, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

We're working on possibly tweaking the rouge blanks xD. Bye Dark, we'll miss you. 12:23, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

May StarClan light your path, Dark. 15:42, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Aww, well I respect your choice, but you know that we're gonna miss you! Take care and hope to maybe see you again on here someday 15:55, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

I remember you bein' leader when I first joined. (Never posted any art for 3 months) Anyways, bye Dark, may StarClan light your path. 16:58 Fri Dec 30

You were a great member, Dark! Good luck in life! 18:54, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

You were one of the best leaders, bye. 19:56, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Although I didn't really get to know you, I hear you were one of the best leaders in PCA. So bye. 23:44, Fri, Dec, 30, 2011

Bye Dark. You were the leader when I first joined. You were an amazing leader. You will be greatly missed. 15:57, December 31, 2011 (UTC)

Bye, Dark. Never really met you, but I heard a bit about you. :) We wish you farewell!  18:42, December 31, 2011 (UTC)

A Question for Alts
I've been looking over a couple of character pages, and I've been looking down at the character art section. For Firestar, I noticed he had a golden alt. I was wondering if that golden alt should be a tabby, because Firestar is a tabby, and if he was mistakenly called golden, he would be a golden tabby? I was wondering about this for all of the alts, too. 15:45, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

I kept telling Mint to make him a tabby when he was doing Fire's alt. I think it should be as it is a form of ginger, I'm pretty sure 15:56, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

I'm not sure if I've come across a golden cat without it being a tabby, so I think it'd just be the same rule as the gingers. 23:48, Fri, Dec, 30, 2011

Yeah, I haven't either. So maybe if there is a golden cat without stripes we should tweak it? 03:14, December 31, 2011 (UTC)

Just another notice
Okay, there's been some changes. I won't be on until probably next week, the most is until February. My computer has a virus and because I don't have an antivirus disc, the guy's lookin' for it. 20:10, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Okay, see you then Icey, hope you can get on when you can! 23:52, Fri, Dec, 30, 2011

Multiple Alternates
In Cats of the Clans, Graystripe is shown as dark gray. Also Mudfur was described with a dark pelt in CP, and Bluestar was described as a pale gray she-cat as well as a gray she-cat at Crookedpaw's first Gathering, also in CP. Would they get alternates for that? Bluestar11796 21:38, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Graystripe: no. Mudfur: if his main description just says brown, no. If it says something like light brown, then yes. Bluestar: I think so. 22:35, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

For Bluestar, it was just the lighting, Bluepaw said so herself. She said she looked more blue in daylight, so that would mean it was just the lighting. I don't think she'd get an alt in that case. ♔ⓅⓐⓁⓔⒸⓛⒶⓦ♕  ☆StarClan be with you★  22:48, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Oi, now I remember Paley! I checked Mudfur's page, yeah I guess he'd get one. He's the only one out of them. 22:51, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

Unless it was the lighting in that case as well. What time of day was it when he was described as such? 22:53, December 30, 2011 (UTC)

I seem to recall someone saying that if the cat was just brown, and he went to a lighter or darker shade (brown to light brown or brown to dark brown), then he wouldn't get an alt. The only way he would was if he went dark to light or vice versa. We could chalk dark brown up to being part of his description and tweak his images, though. 04:56, December 31, 2011 (UTC)

I agree with Oblivion on that. I personally have having alts for different shades, so id be happy if we could just add it to the description. 22:21, December 31, 2011 (UTC)

His description says he is light brown. So he does not need tweaked. 00:48, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, I fail. I thought it was just brown because I never thought to look. However, I don't really see him getting an alternate for being described as the same colour, just a few shades off. I personally really don't want to see that. 00:51, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

@ Paley: she was also described as a dark gray she-cat on the page right before that one, so maybe not a light alt., but probably dark. Bluestar11796 06:09, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

But what about a cat who is described as light and dark. Let's say a new cat called Morningsplash is a tortoiseshell in the alligences, is called "light" on page 53 and then dark on page 76. What happens then? I think that Mistystar and a couple others have been in that situation. 02:28, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Seriously, guys. We need to look at the lighting at the point in which he was called dark. If the mistake occured at night or when it was stormy, it would not be a mistake. 02:31, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

I was just about to say that, Shelly. Can we get the page number? I searched "dark brown" in the browse inside and nothing came up for Mudfur. 02:33, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Crookedstar's Promise, page 477, "Mudfur dark pelt moved beside the nest." And sorry, Bluestar (known as Bluepaw at the time) wasn't called dark gray; she was called just gray. Crookedstar's Promise, page 161, "The gray cat shifted her paws." And for pale gray, CP, pg. 160, "Watch out!" A pale gray she-cat with ThunderClan scent turned and hissed at him a he fell against her." Bluestar11796 18:23, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Possibility for Dovewing alt.
Alright, so we all know that the chapter pictures usually depict main characters (note:usually). So, there's a picture that depicts a gray cat that is perhaps peering over a log. This was most likely Dovewing (Dovepaw when she was first shown in the picture). However, the picture has a paler paw, a pale pattern around the eyes, and a lighter muzzle. I know that there's no real proof this was Dovewing, but it's a possibility. If you disagree, I understand, I'm battling it out between myself as well. Please at least consider this. 17:23, December 31, 2011 (UTC)

No, I don't believe that she would have an alt. for this. Like you said, we don't really know if that is her or not. We would need proof if that is actually her. 18:37, December 31, 2011 (UTC)

Nevermind, I've got something better than that. The cover of The Fourth Apprentice. Dovepaw was depicted the same way, although we can't be sure of the paw. 00:10, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

I don't think that'd get an alt. because it is relatively minor, just a couple of shades of difference. Breeze whisker  01:05, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Suggestion for a new blank
I know I posted this in my recent comments, but I think it would be really cool to see a "prisoner charart" and a new blank for it. Cats who where prisoners in another clan (this applies for clan cats only like Yellowfang and Brokenstar) would have an image with it's head bowed like it's sulking NOT (sorry if you guys think i'm yelling, I just want to prove a point.) like bowing to someone where it's head is nearly touching the ground but something like where like an apprentice is being scolded by a leader. :D That's just a suggestion, so it's okay if you guys think it isn't nessasary, but like I said before it would be really cool. :) Cats that would have a "prisoner charart" would be cats like Yellowfang, Brokenstar(even though he was called an elder while he was prisoner, he was a prisoner), Hollyleaf (that time in Dark River I think where she was prisoner in Riverclan and squirrelflight came to rescue her), Ivypool (held prisoner in I think Fading Echos or Night Whispers in Shadowclan), Rainstorm (the fourth apprentice where he was in Thunderclan), Mistystar, Stonefur, Feathertail, and Stormfur in the darkest hour and if there are some cats I'm missing them too. :) Think about it please! And like I said it's okay if there shouldn't be one. :) 02:21, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

I don't really think we've seen enough prisoners in the series to warrant this... Brokentail, Yellowfang, Stonefur, Mistyfoot, Featherpaw, Stormpaw, Sol, and Ivypaw... eight cats don't warrant a blank in my eyes. 02:30, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Rainstorm was decidedly not a prisoner, by the way. 02:31, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

What about the healers, though? There's only four we've ever seen. Though I don't really feel we need another new blank 02:33, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

I think blanks are only nessessary for the rank of the character in the allegiances. Since I can only think of ten cats for this I'm not really sure about this. Most cats that are prison are only prisoner for a few chapters. Plus, sorta tired of talking about new/tweaked blanks. Sorry about the edit conflict x_x 02:34, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Yeah I agree if any should get blanks it should be cats for the Great clans, or even other main animals, like Midnight. 03:23, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Okay! :) 15:38, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Someday, I might see doing something like that, but right now there's enough other charart waiting that I don't see a point to creating a blank for something that isn't really a rank. Maybe someday, when Warriors' Run is up and they're not getting published anymore, maybe. Becuase the constant flow of new characters and character changes will stop. 16:25, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Erase tweaks
I was just wondering if I could go through the tweak week list and delete the ones that are already being worked on/reserved, or finished, it gets confusing with the tweaks that are already finished and the ones that still need work. 15:32, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

I'm not sure if warriors are allowed to do that. But I definitly do that myself too. 17:23, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Certainly! If you'd like to go through that whole mess of work, feel free. This also brings up a point that's been brewing in my mind for a while. When a users reserves a tweak, strike it out, it'd make it easier to see so that when a lead archives the charart after the tweak, they don't have to search through the whole list. (Even with cntrl F, it takes so long....) Thoughts? 21:06, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

YES, Scarlet. It's really annoyingly tedious to find all the ones that haven't been taken off the list even after a senior member (haha new lingo?) has archived the section on the tweak page. I agree with this suggestion wholeheartedly. 22:05 Sun Jan 1

Should we do the same thing for the images that were redone? 23:06, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Yep. Definitely. And anything that has been finished and approved can be removed from the list - you don't have to be a senior member to do that. 00:17 Mon Jan 2

Okay I went through the entire 'needing to be tweaked' section, I think someone else did the others. -- 16:23, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Mousefang, Nightfur, and Oakstep
Poking my nose in things again. ^^ Would these three qualify for loner chararts, seeing as Spiderstar and Brackenheart got loner images? Sky-Jedi  You will talk to me. 02:13, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Yes, I think so. That makes sense. 02:19, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Aren't we redoing the loner blanks, though? 03:27, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

If they do get the images, I agree with Ivy. We should wait for the blanks. 03:28, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Good point. -goes to remove her reservation-... 03:32, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Change "Lead Meetings" into "Project Meetings"?
Some of you noticed the recent small argument that occured in the comments of Atelda's SW nomination. In it, Breezewhisker brought up a very good point: one of the biggest problems in this project is lack of communication. I think this could partially be solved by ending "Lead Meetings" (meetings limited to only senior warriors and up) and change them to "Project Meetings". We do have "the next chat" messages at the top of this page, but they are barely attended and haven't been scheduled since October. From here on, I think that important meetings usually only announced to senior warriors, the deputy, and leader, should be planned a week in advance, at least, and should be announced in the project news section, allowing any member of the project that wishes to attend to have a chance to do so.

The senior warriors, deputy, and leader cannot represent the majority of the project. If a majority of the project were allowed to participate in the more important meetings of members, I feel communication of ideas in the project would be much easier. Of course, there's much more that needs to be done about this besides what I'm proposing, but I feel that this sttep could be helpful. 16:08, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

I have to agree. If all (at least most) of the project's members participated in meetings, we would get more opinions on what would come in the future for PCA. 16:21, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Nettlesplash Apprentice
Hi I don't know if apprentices are allowed to do charart but I was sorta wanting to do Nettlesplash as an apprentice, because he is a solid colored cat I believe and he doesn't have a new apprentice image and If anyone isn't doing him/requested to do him I would like to do him. 20:32, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

Apprentices can do chararts. All you have to do is go to the PCA page and reserve him on the reservation table. Just make sure that no one else has reserved him (i.e. Ctrl F). 20:37, January 2, 2012 (UTC)