Warriors Wiki talk:Charart

=For Approval= Take it to the approval page

=Tweaked= Take it to the tweak page

=Discussion=

Apprentice Tutorials Makeover
So as most of you should know, since Snowed of Lightning mentioned it above, that I will help out with the apprentice tutorials' update. I want to start ASAP, and I want to know from you guys which ones need updating. We aren't claiming which oines to do yet, but Snowed of Lightning says she wants to redo the black cat tutorial.

Which tutorials do you think need updating? 0:41 Wed May 7

Mottled and flecked. 07:03, May 7, 2014 (UTC)

I wouldn't mind a tweak to the tortoiseshell and dual-colored ones to make them a little more natural, so to say. (the ones Iceheart and Loonie did) The tortie one only shows pale torties, I think, and the dual colored one should have a bit more variety. I will say this, though. No one needs to touch Bloo's marbled tabby one- it's perfect in every way, shape, and form. 8DD

Yes Snowed of Lightning. That one is fine too. I agree with both of you. 20:17 Wed May 7

The eye and shading charts need updating. And possibly the adding stripes tweak tutorial... Idk. 20:55, 05/7/2014

We should add more diversity in tutorials, like having some be using queen blanks, deputy blanks, leader blanks, kit blanks, etc. Notquiterocketwildbokan (talk) 21:17, May 7, 2014 (UTC)

Oooh, yes, that's a fantastic idea. I find it awkward to try and tabby on a blank that isn't shown in a tutorial because that's how I learned the way the tabby stripes should go. I'm sure others feel the same, so the project and all the users would benefit from the use of more than just the warrior blank (which is the most commonly used blank) for the tutorials. 22:50, 05/7/2014

Yes, fabulous. I was thinking that the shading placement image needs updating as well, and the color chart too; it could have a few more colors (if there are any). 2:02 Fri May 9

See, that's the thing with the color chart. I don't think it's a good idea to take that for perfect, since the colors are only a basic example of what you could use. It's the same with the ear pink. It should really only be used as a guide for what color area you should start with if you're new...but as this project has shown, there are a lot of different colors and shades that you could use. I'd be all for updating the shading placement to show different styles too. ^^ If someone has the time I'd say two styles for each blank but that would be madness and I don't expect anyone to sit around and do that. \

I've got time. I might even have time for the frigging eyes DX I already started 3 days ago I'm not even half way done cause I don't have the patience. 23:20 Fri May 9

I think that under each section, say, dual-coloured, we should have multiple tutorials by different users. I don't think that unless they are misleading, tutorials shouldn't be replaced but kept in respect to the artists. I like Icehearts, and I don't want to see them replaced. With different tutorials under each section, then users can select from a variety of diverse styles and choose which one fits them best instead of just looking at one tutorial.

White and black (individual white cats and black cats I mean) is also misleading. They imply that you're not allowed to use pure white or a really really dark gray, when in fact that is quite the opposite. While it's possible (and I've done it for fun), I believe having tutorials that show using pure white and darker gray should be an option- someone once told me that using pure white was forbidden, and that's completely and totally misleading. =P

I agree with you all. So, now, shall we start with the tutorial's make-over? I can start with the 'tabbers' coding on the page. Then, I can place the tutorials according to their level of difficulty (Charart basics, like shading styles, eye placement, etc, then to patterns, like tabby and mottled/flecked, etc, and then tweaking, etc.). Sound like a plan? 16:50 Mon May 19

It's more than okay with me, if you want to start with some of the basics, Hawk. What say you, PCA? Should we get started on this?

Sounds good to me. Might as well get this all done sooner so we can give newer users a more updated look at how us dorks over at PCA art. love you all you awesome nerds  20:33, 05/20/2014

Okay, the tutorials have been put into tabbers. What do y'all think? I guess now we can start updating/making tutorials. So I was thinking to add:
 * Texture Tutorial
 * Smudged Shading Style Tutorial
 * Torbie Tutorial

I know that Snowed of Lightning wants to redo/update the black cat tutorial, and I'd like to make a texture tutorial as well as update the eye placement and shading placement. I can also take care of the smudge-shading tutorial. So pretty much I just want to hog everything for myself mwahahaha No jk jk jk Is everyone okay with this? 21:29 Tue May 20

I defiantly agree with adding texture and torbies; sounds great to me! 13:00, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

I'd also like to see tutorials for how to use Pixlr, Gimp, paint.NET, and everything else that is usually used. I think it'd be helpful. 13:04, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Oooh, having ones per program, or at least ones teaching the basics, would be something I'd be okay with. Although I can't help, since I use Photoshop, it's still a really good thing to consider. I feel bad when I can't help people who come and ask me, since I'm literally so inexperienced with those, especially Paint.NET and Pixlr.

I totally agree with Snowed of Lightning about that. Now; shall we get started? 11:50 Mon Jun 2

I've got no complaints about getting this rolling. Let's get it started. Is each person gonna take a different one, or are we just letting everyone do their own versions? 'cause each person has different methods and I think just letting everyone share their ideas would be the easiest and fairest way to go about it. I just want to do a bi-colored and the regular black, and maybe something on white if I have the energy, and you guys can do the rest.

I think we should let all warrior and aboves do their own versions. As said, it's fair and everyone has their own methods and it's a good way to share ideas. owo

Good. Okay, let's get started. I would like to claim the torbie and texture tutorials. I'll start right away, the upload it onto the apprentice tutorials. If that's okay, anyways...1:21 Sat Jun 7

Suggestion for a new requirement to become a SW
So I was thinking (I've actually had this idea for quite a while but whatever) and I think a new requirement should be added to become a sw. I think that in order to become a SW you have to nominate at least one article and it must pass in PW, PR, PB, or PC. This way users will have to help the other projects to advance in PCA and SW nominations won't be as much about pretty art. I think it would help, and when ou think about it it isn't hard at all to get a nomination in a project. x3 21:01, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

That's acutally a really good idea. Didn't this project close because of other projects being ignored? If we do this, then that means that the other projects would benifit, too. Notquiterocketwildbokan (talk) 21:03, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, it did. ^ I like this idea. Not only would they be participating in other projects, they might actually learn to like working on the mainspace articles and become more active members in other projects. I'm all for this- the main focus is not PCA, but it does have fun parts. Plus, as Duck said, it really isn't very hard to nominate and get them to pass.

I really like this idea. I've gotten a page up to silver and it wasn't hard. Granted it was a very minor character's page, but it wasn't hard at all. Should be an easy task to accomplish for everyone. 21:07, 05/10/2014

I agree, nominating is a piece of cake. This will probably stop the other projects being ignored (compared to the PCA). 16:37, May 14, 2014 (UTC)

Really though, nothing you do can get people to work in other projects or the mainspace if they really don't interest. I don't exactly support the idea tbh, because that requirement has nothing to do with being a PCA lead. If you want the requirements to get harder, then they should be more relevant to PCA. There were many people who were PCA leads without having anything to do with other projects, because they feel that their skills don't lie with those projects. But you can't deny them a lead position if they really deserve it for that reason. Scarlet, for an example mainly edited PCA, and would you say that she didn't deserve her spot because her skills lay here, or that she didn't contribute. Same with a lot of other people that I could name before. Personally, there are other methods of trying to raise the activity in other projects. Plus, guys, PCA is still contributing.

I have to agree with Stoner. PCA leads are picked because of their performance in PCA not elsewhere on the wiki. 10:29 Fri May 16 2014

Wasn't the entire reason we closed PCA in the first place to shift the focus to other projects? While the leads are picked because of the performance in PCA, it would still be nice to see them edit elsewhere every once in a while. While we can't deny them a lead spot because they don't edit in other projects, it would still be nice to see them edit elsewhere. But, it's not for everyone, as stated before. Would membership in another project be a better qualification instead of a nomination having successfully passed? You don't have to nominate- I see people who comment on discussions in other projects that are PCA users, but they'd rather not nominate. Paleh was a prime example of that ( I'm not calling you out, Paleh, I swear, you were just the name I could think of off the top of my head and you were a project lead at one point too ). While she didn't nominate, she was still active in other projects and helping them in whatever ways she could.

I think membership is too easy, you can be a member of a project and never contribute I think that it should be a nomination or an active membership, meaning they comment on stuff and stuff like that. 18:25, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

No-Rank Blank
Okay, Kate says on her blog, that the ancient cats, do not have ranks. Therefore, I'd like to bring back the idea of using a no-rank blank for these, and the characters we have descriptions for, but no rank. As-in, a true no-rank blank. This would also be good for other characters as well, I'd think- maybe Brightspirit and the others, since it's mentioned they were alive at one point in time. We also have some characters from River's group that would fall under needing this as well... Basically, for people that say we don't need the rank, we actually have a canon purpose that would require, so to say, a blank. Basically for people that can't load Kate's blog, here's what was said:
 * Beebs
 * Oh, Kate, I’ve been wondering this for a while, and I wonder if you know anything about this. In The Sun Trail, are the cats that aren’t elders, queens, kits, or Stoneteller sharpclaws? And Hawk Swoop, Falling Feather, and Jackdaw’s Cry being softpaws, since they’re called “young”? I’d be thankful if you know anything of the Tribe cats’ ranks at all, since it’s never mentioned in the main story.


 * Kate
 * The Tribe didn’t have ranks. The younger cats are just considered softpaws until they have more experience. It’s not as formalised as with the Clans.

So, yeah. Kate's declared it so. I'd also think this would apply to Gray Wing, Clear Sky, Turtle Tail, ect. Those cats who left, who used to be members of the rankless group. So, now we have a reason- so you can't say it's still not needed when it's explicitly said that these cats have no ranks.

Sounds great - a new blank! So, how would this blank look? 14:30, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Well, the discussion is for the possibility of a new blank, so whether or not we'd decide on one/an artist for it/ect, depends on how this goes. =P As for how they'd look, that's all up to whomever creates blanks. That's why we vote, to decide on whichever stance we like best.

I agree that the new blank should be added. Also, this would probably be needed for Slant since it's not stated what rank he was before his death, since Jayfeather did see him before, implying that he was alive at one point, too. 19:48, May 30, 2014 (UTC)


 * I'm inclined to disagree about Slant getting one since we don't actually know if he was part of this ancient Tribe or the Tribe when they had ranks. Same with Brightspirit and her parents since they had ranks as Clan cats we just don't know what they were. Basically, I could see an ancient Tribe blank but not a no-rank blank. 21:14 Fri May 30 2014

I think that whatever it's called, it shouldn't be called a 'no-rank' blank 'cause that doesn't sound right. If we were to decide on having these blanks, wouldn't we just have a vote like this?
 * Yes, Stoner. That's the only fair way to ensure everyone who wants to participate gets a fair chance.

I'm gonna jab this for comments. There are tons of you editing, so let's go. =P

I'm sorry but I can't agree on this. Sure, we can have art for characters that are with ranks, but ranks represent cats who have the same thing in common. How can we display that if we don't even know about the cats who don't have ranks? Also, I think it's vital that if this DOES get through, we shouldn't make it until a while at least. There are several pages out there that still need to be finished and completed, and if we focus all oru energy on art, then I don't think they'll ever get done. 00:16, June 7, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I agree with this idea for a no-rank blank, because I'm sure users passing by the wiki would pass by a cat, say, Twisted Branch, and see him without an image and probably say, "Why doesn't he have an image when other cats do?" 22:03 Sat Jun 7

If we're making a no-rank blank to make more images then we're doing it for the totally wrong reasons and judging by what some of have said that is why you want a no-rank blank. I honestly agree with Icy I don't really think we should make one at this point. Maybe later, but when hundreds of chapter pages need to be finished, and tons of sections and whole articles have yet to be completed, we should focus on finishing the current wikia quota (articles/chararts that still need to be finished) before tackling other things. 23:13, June 7, 2014 (UTC)

If anything, we do need an Ancient group blank, since Kate did confirm they have no specified ranking. I wasn't suggesting it to make more images, so I'd rather not be accused of such. I phrased it as a no-rank blank because that's what it would be. (and because it would get everyone's attention) No specific rank for Ancient cats. We don't need to use it for cats outside of that group. Why should we have to wait to create another needed blank (for a group of cats which none of our current blanks allow and we have author confirmation or are you all missing that???????). If it's not a no-rank, then fine. I'm more concerned about at least getting the Ancient cats images, since they were not sharpclaws, nor will their actual ranking be said in-book since they don't have one.

Wait... If they don't have a 'rank' then that means they're rogues/loners. A rogue isn't a rank, just a feral/stray cat.

Not the Ancients, Stoner? They're an organized group of cats, and they're not rogues or loners. Calling them rogues or loners makes absolutely no sense...and given the definition of rogues and loners that we have, to call them that would be wrong. o.O Rogues and loners are usually on their own, or in very small groups. They're not strays or anything like that. They're an organized group, just like the modern Tribe or Clans....they just don't have official ranks, since Kate said they weren't as formal as the Clans and such...not sure what you meant, but the Ancient cats are not loners or rogues.

I disagree with the no-rank blank idea. However, with the Ancient Tribe blanks, those technically would be considered a rank. They're members of the Ancient Tribe. Imo, that's more than enough to be considered a rank. We would have to make new blanks for them, since the ones we already have on here are all Modern Clans, Modern Tribe, etc. I'd like to see that on here so we have a more accurate representation of the Ancient Tribe, not just "pretty cat art" wise, but also content-wise. It shows the viewer that the cat has /significance/ in the way words can't, tbh. After all, the cats who don't have descriptions clearly aren't that vital to the series. We have descriptions for the ancients, so they are clearly important. i'm sorry this is so wordy  13:57, 06/14/2014

Alternate queen?
So, for the queen images, am I allowed to take a queen image that hasn't been done yet and put it under tweak (on the table)? 13:39, June 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes, you can. Although it wouldn't be a tweak. You can have one original image and one redone queen, as long as the queen image image isn't one that hasn't been done yet. Like, take for example, you can't do Cinderfur's StarClan image and Ryestalk's queen image- since Ryestalk's queen image was never made. You can do (examples not saying they're available) Cinderfur's StarClan image and Whitewing's queen, since that image was already approved and just needs to be redone.

Join Request
Can I join, please? c: CapitanWolf (talk) 20:08, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

Nevermind. CapitanWolf (talk) 20:00, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

What happened?
Hey, so I was looking through the Approval page, and I saw that the image I had put up had been taken down, but I never withdrew it, or had it declined, and it's not in any of the archives. What happened? 00:29, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Nevermind, I found it. It wasn't showing up. Sorry! 00:30, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Rejoin?
Hi, I'm  back. FINALLY :D I think my highest rank was Apprentice in Charart, so can I rejoin? <span style="">13:50 Thu Jun 5

Sure! I'm pretty sure you know the rules. C: 20:03, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Join?
May I join, please? I understand if the project is full, but I'd really like to join.

Sure! Be sure to read the guidelines, which are on the front page in a link. You'll be listed as a kit. 20:01, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Cinderfur Charart
Hi, could you please take a look at my Cinderfur Charart? I would love some critiques, and if it's ok, then I would be honered if I was to put it on his page! Thanks!

http://warriors.wikia.com/wiki/File:Cinderfur_Wikia.png

StormyDaCat (talk) 17:55, June 7, 2014 (UTC)

Userbox Typos
I saw typos for a lot of the userboxes. Somebody should fix them. <span style="">00:16 Sun Jun 8

Hi Cloudwhisker! PCA doesn't handle userboxes, Project:Userboxes does, so please take up any typos you see on a userbox on their talkpage, and if you could tell us what userboxes when you post it on PU's talk, it would help tons. c: 13:37, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Okay, thanks! Sorry for posting in the wrong place ^^' <span style="">13:50 Sun Jun 8

Rejoin
Hi, I'm back. Can I rejoin? <span style="">20:41, 06/8/2014

Shading Tint
Hi. Anyways, I had this nagging question that I just have to ask right now.

Does that shadong color need to match the other images?

I hate black shading. I'm not saying for y'all to stop, I'm just saying even if you don't care, let's say, if a white cat were to be tweaked for gray shading, but the shading needs to be defined somewhere else, does the shading tint /really/ need to match the other images? I was not harassed for Softwing's queen image, but Beebly has brought up an interesting point of matching shading tints on Brightsky's warriors image. And most of you should know it is quite a challenge for some people to shade a white cat with black without making it look flat.

In my opinion, I say that shading tint should not have to match the other images, even if it makes the set look natural. kthxbye and pls don't shoot me  <span style="">0:44 Mon Jun 9

Each image is a different pose and a different moment in a cat's life. You don't have shading come from the same angle each time, so that means the light source in each image can be different. Different sources can cast different intensities in light, so one image may have soft lighting while another may have it be harsher. As long as your tint doesn't completely change the color of the cat, it shouldn't matter.

If your tinted color changes the color of the character entirely, giving it a green glow or something like that, then your shading likely has some issues, and the fault isn't in the hue. 03:42, June 9, 2014 (UTC)

Aww, but shading white cats with black is fun. ;-; It's fairly easy ( for me anyways ), but it's not for everyone. I'm gonna second Leggy here. I don't care if it matches- if the base colors do, if the tint's slightly different, it's not gonna bother me that much.

people should be allowed to use whatever damn tint they want or black shading as long as it isnt screwing up anything else. theres no need to police people on this shit. 03:52, June 9, 2014 (UTC)

Skt please watch the language, remember the wiki should be around PG-13. Anyway I don't really think it matters about the tint. 03:56, June 9, 2014 (UTC)

Hi again
So some of the more longtime members might remember this disaster. If you weren't there, feel free to read it for some context on this post.

I was stupid. I was blind with rage, not noticing that the other users didn't actually have anything against me. They were trying to calm me down, but I didn't even listen. I didn't know anything about losing, or failure. Well, it wasn't so much not knowing failure as accepting failure. I am so ashamed of it I don't have the courage to read all of it. I'm not sure if back then, I thought protesting against the general verdict would get me to SW status, or I knew that I wouldn't anyway but chose to vent on how people that joined after me managed to get to SW status or whatever. Maybe it was a mix of the two. Or a third possibility: that I enjoyed making the others angry, getting "revenge". That I actually understood what they were trying to say, but not trying to be a "suck-up".

And for all of that, I am so, so sorry.

This apology probably won't be accepted, since this happened more than two years ago and not a lot of users here will be familiar with me now.

Anyway, I had a dream last night that my real-life peers (past and present) hated me because I cried too much. It's what I fear. Being hated. Even if I don't want to let other people get to me, even if I try for them not to, they still do. When I woke up, I suddenly remembered this incident. Maybe forgetting about it is apology enough, but it's still there, archived for anyone to read over.

I don't want to be hated. I don't want people to think I'm the same now as I was then. I'm even scared of how you guys will reply to this post, this vent. Yes, I'm scared of how I will be treated on the Internet. That's pathetic, don't you think? I guess I haven't totally changed for the better. I was bolder back then. Forgive me, I think I went a bit too personal with this. Forgive me for not putting this into better words.

And forgive me for being too apologetic. C: Leafstrike  Talk  19:11, June 21, 2014 (UTC)

I don't have anything against you, and I guess I accept your apology. Now, is this a return to the wiki or just an apology? 19:19, June 21, 2014 (UTC)

I think I accpet it too. Reading through the so-called 'disaster' made me kinda upset. I went though a point on my old account where I was so ''angry because of one thing or another that I left too. ''But, you have proved that you are sincere by apologizing like this, which is good. I think what you said was wrong, but the fact that you came back, apologizing for this, shows who you really are as a person. It's in the past, so let's forgive and forget, shall we? :) 19:33, June 21, 2014 (UTC)

Beebs: I don't think I'm coming back to the wiki (I lost interest in the books). I just want to get this out of the way. x_x Leafstrike  Talk  19:46, June 21, 2014 (UTC)