Forum:AaU Revival?

I wish to bring back the Adopt a User project. Moonflight has presented me with the problems:


 * There are too many apprentices, and not enough mentors.
 * New users often up and leave, (without any notice) which wastes time, help, and space.
 * There are already help pages, and if people don't read them, it's only because they're too lazy.

My response?


 * One option is changing the mentor to apprentice ratio. I haven't exactly thought this one through fully, but I believe that we can come up with some solution to this problem.
 * We could elicit a commitment from users; not something that binds them to the wiki, but something that says, "If you're going to up and leave, inform us before you do so." It's not the best solution, but that's why I created this forum.
 * Help pages are impersonal. Yes, they tell you everything you could ever want to know about wiki editing, but you also don't get that mentor-apprentice bond. Apprentices often feel in awe of their mentors and their seemingly boundless amounts of knowledge. Mentors also help new users learn important social skills that I don't think they could learn from simple help pages.

Okay, so my responses aren't fully developed, but again, that's why I created this forum! I'm asking everybody here, "How we can reopen AaU?" Any suggestions or comments on improvement are greatly appreciated. 09:13, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

Well, maybe we could have some new mentors. Like Mistystar139, or you Wildheart. We could pick some users that completely know the wiki's rules and have them as mentors. -- 10:41, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

The problem is that with the amount of new users to the wiki (you know, including all the people who join all the projects, ask for a charart or a siggie, and then leave) there aren't enough mentors to deal with them all, unless we drastically increase the amount of apprentices that mentors are given. However, this wastes a lot of time and effort that help pages can provide, and that's the basis of Moonflight's argument. I know, I know, I'm fighting against myself, but I'm just trying to clarify her argument. Anyway, thanks, Rainy, for being the first person to comment! =3 10:59, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

Your welcome! What you say is true though....ugh, this is really hard. Does anyone else have an idea? -- 11:01, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

I think we should lower the requirements for mentors-- Wild  fire  11:48, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

Wildfire's right. I think that the requirements should be lowered. I'd love to help out, but I know I don't have the proper percentage amount. It's a little too high, honestly. They should look not only at edit amounts, but, also the contributions. Anyone can get that percentage, if they really want it - by editing the main articles and such. I support the revival of this project. -- Cloud skye ♫  De  le  te   ♫ 12:51, May 16, 2011 (UTC)


 * It's going to be hard to do change the requirements. We simply cannot let anyone be a mentor. It is about contributions, already. We need to make sure the mentors are trustworthy, and competent in Wiki-Code.


 * As for developing social skills through this, well, if they don't have said social skills, do you really think they should be on this site? If they cant work with other people, they might as well just leave. I mean, honestly. Other wikis have functioned fine without Adopt-A-User; some of them are even better off. I mean, we might as well delete the help pages since you all think they're so useless. The wiki has functioned fine without Adopt-A-User before. Most of the apprentices are just people who make a charart, make a siggie, and leave. Why should we re-open something that fixes absolutely nothing? I mean, I grew up on those help pages and tutorials. I think I turned out okay; I stuck around, and I think I would have been worse off without them, if say, I only relied on a mentor. I did have a mentor; Maplefern, but I only asked her for one thing; how to create redirects. I actually consulted the help pages more. If you actually gave them a look, you'll see how helpful they are.


 * These users are not children; at least, not the ones that actually improve the wiki. If they are mature enough, and want to learn, they should be able to adjust to actually finding help for themselves. There is little a help page doesn't have that a mentor does. Chararts are the only thing. Belive it or not, help pages are actually more helpful. Mentors don't know everything, and neither do help pages. But, if the help pages don't have the information, then ask someone. Why must we put extra effort in for users who are too lazy and undetermined to take the extra step to learn something. If they won't do that, they are not worth it. And I can guareentee that only about 10% of the users that become apprentices will stay around. Adopt-A-User is just an organized system for something that already exists. You say they need someone to look to. They're not children. I know role-models are important, but people develop role models who weren't even their mentors. I did.


 * Don't you see? Adopt-A-User is not needed. The only issue is the high-traffic amount of new users joining the wiki. Adopt-A-User won't solve that problem. If anything, it'll make things worse. If they're not making an effort now, what makes you think they'll make an effort if we re-open it? 13:59, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

I like your idea, I did have one of my own. I think it would be helpful to have several users make a page on their advice for new users, and when they join and get their help links on their talk page, those would be linked as well. Doing it in informal, helpful language might help them understand what we mean, and they could ask for help for what they don't understand. The page could contain a huge contipiliationn (spelling fail, sorry I don't have Firefox at school) of information for various parts of the Wiki that should cover topics they may not understand, as well as basic info on Project Charart (even if they don't plan on joining) and stuff like that. -- 16:31, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I have an idea. What if there were apprentice requirements too? For example, that you can't just leave when you get bored and that you have to go on on two or three specified days snd times that you and your mentor will be on. How about it? Leopard claw Eyes watching in the Dark…  16:39, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

Ivystripe: Good thinking, but there's already the Welcome message, that provides links to help pages. I could add a few more links to it.

Leopardclaw: I was thinking that. I have a feeling that no matter what I say, people won't agree to leave Adopt-A-User closed. I think those would be a good idea. 17:08, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

@Moonflight i think we should bring this back new users need help the reason no one reads the help pages is because, no offence, they're way too long. I asked Bramble about everything and when I found out there was a mentor program I thought that would make it way easier but then I realised it was closed and had to keep asking Bramble. So if we reopened this project i think it would really help new users, if we could get them to follow an agreement saying that they would stay for at least one month or until they made a certian amount of edits that would be better. Wild fire  21:30, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

I don't know. It is kind of useless, with the help pages and everything, but sometimes its nice to just have someone who you can ask questions to. It is a good idea lower the mentor requirements, and give strict requirements to apprentices, and it seems like most users do want to have the project. 22:26, May 16, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I agree with Mistystar. I've really missed AaU, and I would like it to come back. 13:02, May 17, 2011 (UTC)

Mistystar: You can already ask anyone. Why should they be restricted to one person? The only reason the help pages are so long is because that's what's necessary. The topic you're trying to learn cannot be fully explained and comprehended without the necessary explanations. You try explaining it in a couple of sentences and let me know how it goes.

Anyway, no one sees my point except a few users. They don't understand that it's not needed. They can ask anyone any questions they might have. They could easily ask someone to mentor them unnofficially. Why must we put extra work into it?

Of course, no one understands. 20:14, May 17, 2011 (UTC)

PSYCH! I'm just joshing you. I've carefully considered everything you guys said, and while I still believe we can do without the project, if we can answer the following questions, we can re-open the project.


 * What guidelines must be changed and created for apprentices and mentors?
 * How can we make sure apprentices and mentors will be able to stick around?

Go for it, guys. I admit, I do miss AaU. It just saddens me that only one apprentice of mine has stuck around. I want to train an apprentice that will be guarrenteed to stick around. Can you guys make guidelines that will really improve the project? Please? I know you guys can. Of course I'll help; I have to, but you guys remember more what it's like to be a new user than this elder here. So, dowit... :P 20:22, May 17, 2011 (UTC)

I never knew AaU, but I always wanted the best user (At least, I think.) as my mentor. But sadly, he is not that active. But I'm all for reopening. ❁  YatzSliversword   Ah, spring...  ❁  23:27, May 17, 2011 (UTC)


 * As much as I want this project to reopen, as I too felt bad for always nagging Eu & Kitsu when I was younger for help as I also didn't use all the help pages xD but managed will without them. It saddens me to say that all of my apprentices have recently left the wikia, but to their own amends for valuable reasons but they all had reached the stage of being fine without me. Honestly, I don't think an apprentice should be able to request who they want as their mentor. In the past, we had so many users that came just for PCA asking for Bramble and other high warriors that it got out of hand and went to the step of letting first come first serve, and the mentor picking the apprentice they wanted. As for seeing how long an apprentice might actually stick around, I think of the user is atleast active on the wiki for a month or two should meet the qualification. This doesn't mean them just browsing around and posting on project pages about their opinions, but also helping with the articles. Add on to those and help WITH the project.-- ♩ Shimmerpool  ♪ Never B ♭ ♫ Sometimes B ♯ ♬ But Always B ♮ |undefined 00:54, May 18, 2011 (UTC)