Warriors Wiki talk:Characters/Archive 79

Mothwing
Since apparently there are those that are in doubt as to whether or not Mothwing should be counted as an elder, I'm here to present the following passages from Mistystar's Omen directly.

'From chapter 6.'' Mistystar privately dismisses Mothwing but allows her to stay in the MC den for the time being. However, Mothwing is still dismissed, and she allows her to stay in the den for the time being to allow the Clan to mourn the loss of Leopardstar before losing Mothwing.'''

“Willowshine, from now on you will be RiverClan’s sole medicine cat,” she announced. Her heart pounded, and she dug her claws into the earth to stop her legs from shaking. “Mothwing will no longer live with you in this den.” “That’s not fair!” cried Willowshine. “I still have so much to learn!” “StarClan will help you,” Mistystar mewed. She looked at Mothwing, who was staring at her in dismay. “I’ve had enough time to think about this. Mothwing, you have served RiverClan for many seasons, and we are grateful. As an elder, you will be well cared for. No cat needs to know about. . . anything.” Mothwing stepped forward. “Mistystar, I know you want to punish me—” “This is not about punishment!” Mistystar interrupted. “This is about doing what is right for the Clan!” Mothwing twitched one ear. “Don’t you think the Clan has suffered enough change recently, with the loss of Leopardstar? Let them come to terms with that before you make them accept something else. You are not the only cat who has their best interests at heart, Mistystar. I’ll announce my retirement at the next Gathering, but not before.” Her blue eyes flashed briefly with anger. Mistystar gritted her teeth. She must see that I have no choice in this! She cannot be a medicine cat if she doesn’t believe in StarClan! “Very well,” she hissed. “You may stay here for the rest of this moon.” She started to back away, but stopped as Mothwing moved toward her. Placing her muzzle close to Mistystar’s ear, she murmured, “I am so sorry.”

From chapter 10. Mistystar publicly dismisses and sends her to the elders' den.

yowled, “Mothwing! Quick!” Mothwing’s golden head poked out from the elders’ den. “What is it?” Scraps of moss clung to her fur, and Mistystar guessed she had been building herself a nest. “Reedwhisker is hurt!” Mallownose told her, but Mothwing was already pushing her way out of the branches and running across the clearing. The warriors let Reedwhisker slip gently to the ground. Mothwing stared at the gaping wound. “We need cobweb, comfrey, marigold, watermint,” she began. “Robinwing, fetch some soaked moss. Do I smell dog?” “Yes,” mewed Mallownose. “He was bitten by at least one, if not two.” “In that case, we need to get this wound as clean as possible.” Mothwing ran her paw lightly along Reedwhisker’s spine. “I don’t think anything’s broken, but let’s keep him still anyway.” Mistystar stepped forward. Her heart was pounding so hard she could hardly speak. But she reached out with one paw and moved Mothwing away from Reedwhisker. “Let Willowshine do this,” she mewed. Her Clanmates stared at her. “Mistystar, what are you doing?” Graymist exclaimed. “Mothwing is our medicine cat!” “Not anymore,” Mistystar replied softly. Mothwing blinked. “Are you sure you mean this? Reedwhisker is very, very sick.” “Willowshine knows what to do,” Mistystar whispered. “StarClan will help her.” Mothwing flinched, then turned away. “I’ll get her,” she mewed. “I don’t understand!” growled Robinwing. “What’s going on?” “I know what I’m doing,” Mistystar insisted. Willowshine raced up. “Mothwing said Reedwhisker was hurt!” She stopped and stared down at the deputy, whose wound was staining the earth beneath him as scarlet as a sunset. “Great StarClan!” Mistystar lifted her head high. “I know you can heal him, Willowshine. Please, help him.” Willowshine opened her mouth to protest, then shut it with a snap and began examining the injury. Mistystar gazed down at her son. I won’t lose you too, she vowed. I know you need StarClan’s help to survive this, and Mothwing can’t give you that. I’m doing the right thing; I must be. A crowd of cats gathered around Reedwhisker. Mothwing brought herbs to Willowshine, then left. Mistystar heard murmurs ripple around the Clan, ranging from puzzled to angry. “Where’s Mothwing going?” “How can she turn her back on an injured Clanmate? Surely that’s breaking the medicine code!” “Mistystar said she wasn’t the medicine cat anymore.” “What? In the name of StarClan, why not?”

Even if Mothwing didn't get the ceremony, she was dismissed and sent to live as an elder, even if only briefly. We have leaders with leader credentials with less verification that they actually held the rank. 19:47, September 14, 2012 (UTC)

Uh, is this really necessary? I'm pretty sure you copied out like a page when all I found was one line. One line is usually all it takes. And I really don't think you need to post this if I never brought up anything. 20:04, September 14, 2012 (UTC)

Was it necisarry to tell people that I should have begged PC's permission to add cited information to an article? I cited chapter ten because that's the chapter in which she was publically dismissed. I'm sorry you got confused, but I will continue adding cited info to articles without checking with PC first, thank you.

But as for adding all of this info here, I did so in order to thoroughly cover my bases and make sure no one was in doubt of her havbing been an elder. I'm not here to fight. I just don't like to be accused of jumping the gun when I didn't. 20:17, September 14, 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry. I realize that sounded bitter. Really, I'm just trying to cover bases. I'm glad it's been cleared up. 20:22, September 14, 2012 (UTC)

I think this is settled. Archiving. If there's any questions, feel free to bring 'em up.

Marshscar as Leader
I believe that his leader charart and title should be removed. The book states nothing about Marshscar succeeding Ripplestar. He was never shown with a leader name, and for all we know, he may have died before receiving it. The title is pretty much an assumption and I feel it should be removed. -- 19:01, September 9, 2012 (UTC)

I have to agree. As Starry said he could've died before receiving his name, or something could've happened that prevented him from making him official leader. We are just assuming that he was named Marshstar, etc, so I too think it should be removed. 07:12, 10, 09, 2012

He was still leader though as tradition. Ripplestar did die, and since Marshscar was deputy, he would have then become leader. While he was never shown with a leader name, that doesn't mean that he wasn't leader. Once the leader dies, the deputy automatically is leader name or not unless some revolt happens which in this case it didn't. We're not exactly assuming as we are applying the traditional method of the leader/deputy relations to this particular case as it fits. 02:26, September 11, 2012 (UTC)

'Teldy, basically said what I was thinking.^ He was the cat with the most power, his leader died, but he still became leader, even if he didn't get the name. Even if some freak accident happened and he died soon after, he was still leader for a few seconds. =3 02:49, September 11, 2012 (UTC)

Same with... Brightwhisker? It was never said that she was leader, but deputies are automatically leader of the Clan even if they don't have their lives. 02:54, September 11, 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Loonie, 'Teldy, and Duck. Ripplestar died, so that means Marshscar succeeded him, and was, in the literal sense of the word, leader of his Clan. Even if he didn't have his lives or name, he was still in charge of his Clan.

Mmhm. Even if it was for a short period of time, and even if it was never made official by giving him his nine lives, as soon as the leader dies, the deputy is leader of their Clan. Doesn't matter if they haven't gotten their name yet, they're still in charge. So yes, he was leader regardless of whether he ended up getting his proper name or not. 03:04, September 11, 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, but guys... being in charge of the Clan doesn't make you leader. Didn't we decide that when we decided not to give Graystripe leader credentials on his page? Because, by that logic, every time a leader goes off somewhere and has their deputy look after the Clan the deputy should be given a leader listing on their page. A cat has to officially assume the position of leader and be called one to be counted as one. I believe Brightwhisker was, but Marshscar wasn't as far as I remember. And we've had a case in canon in which a deputy has not been granted leader status upon their leader's death. For all we know, Marshscar could have been hit by a falling branch as soon as the story was over and died. We can't assume he took over as leader, for the same reason that we can't assume that every warrior ever mentioned was at one point an apprentice. 21:22, September 11, 2012 (UTC)

Yes, but Graystripe's case was different, his leader was still alive, while Marshscar's wasn't and, we have to go by what the book says, and the book never says that any uprising happened when he was mentioned, so he was, even for a few moments, going by what the book says. =3 21:25, September 11, 2012 (UTC)

And Mudclaw's isn't the same case, either. He was stripped of his deputyship by Tallstar on his deathbed. /Onewhisker/ was deputy upon Tallstar's passing, not Mudclaw.

Alright, alright, I concede. 21:41, September 11, 2012 (UTC)

Then why is there a redirect from Marshstar to Marshscar. We don't know he actually received his leader name, so I think that title should be removed. 06:47, 16, 09, 2012

The redirect is because a while ago, we had a discussion about changing his pagename from Marshstar ro Marshscar, as he was never seen with his leader title, and the redirect was automatically added when his page was moved. =3 13:24, September 16, 2012 (UTC)

Archiving, since I believe this discussion is over.