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This is, as the title suggests, a discussion to argue the pros and cons of implementing a screening process in PCA. How the screening process would work is simple:
- The screening process would be for all new apprentices. Basically, their first charart posted for approval would be their test. Should they display signs that they know the basics of how the project works and how to work with digital art, they will be critiqued as usual. However, should they show proof that they know little to nothing of digital art, believing that the project will spend a month basically instructing them in how to use digital art programs to make a proper charart, they will be immediately declined, removed from the project, and asked to practice on their own time and apply to join again at a later date.
It may sound cruel, but we waste space and time training users and waiting a month for them to finally get it right. We are here to make chararts, not train artists. We need to cull the stream of users joining PCA with no knowledge of digital art. They could still critique art without being a member of PCA, so it's not like they'd be completely barred from project activities.
So, this is open discussion on the topic that shall run for 7 days, until December 17th. Proceed. Shelly For a limited time only 02:26, December 11, 2011 (UTC)
This is the best idea I've heard all day. As you said, it's harsh, but it's necessary. I completely agree. oblivionAudience? 02:32, December 11, 2011 (UTC)
Well, I like this idea, but just for now I don't have a solid vote. Because the problem I see is most of the time, is the new apprentices are unable to get a charart to do, and only end up sitting inactive in the table for weeks until they're removed from the project. So would this just mean if they didn't have a charart to be able to pass the "Test" would be removed from the project? Because they can be good at comments too, and if we do that, we may be losing a useful comment-er. Thistle. 02:35, December 11, 2011 (UTC)
Like I said, not being a member of the project doesn't mean that a person cannot continue to comment. Shelly For a limited time only 02:37, December 11, 2011 (UTC)
I said it on your blog and I'll say it here, this is a bad idea, Warriors Wiki is a site anyone can edit not just artists, and not just the authors, anyone. Read my second commentent on your blog and that should explain it better, you wanted input and you got it. Also if you decline a user and basically say they aren't good enough they will most likely turn againt you, and the project, become a vandel and causing more havoc. WildfireMistystar's Omen! 03:08, December 11, 2011 (UTC)
If a user decides to turn against the website because they were turned down by the project, that's their problem. But PCA is an important part of the website, being one of the bery unique aspects of our site, and we cannot be slowed down by those that join to try to learn digital art or just join for the heck of it. We aren't here to teach people, we're here to make the chararts. That's it. Shelly For a limited time only 03:36, December 11, 2011 (UTC)
I agree, Shelly. PCA already has users who have been on the project long enough who can't get a single charart approved without help. Dew here put an image up for approval without know anything about digital art. How about if you have bad shading, bad coloring in the image, blurring/coloring over the lineart, you have to leave and practice for some time. Stoneclaw 03:40, December 11, 2011 (UTC)
Yes I agree. PCA is getting too many users that join and can't do any digital art. I like the idea of how any user, regardless of if they're in the project or not can comment on art. At least then they can't complain I can't join the project because I've never heard of GIMP. ~DJCandyFun~ I do enjoy fun...8D06:54, Sun, Dec, 11, 2011
I love this idea. This will make the approval page less cluttered, and make users understand this project isn't just for fun. Were supposed to make fantastic art for all of the characters we can, not make sloppy work that the leads want to instantly decline. This screentest may cause problems but it's worth it. We need it. A lot of users don't know what the blur tool, shading and highlights are. This is going to make the project run smoothly. Sweetflower12:29 Sun Dec 11
Do you all not see what this is doing, no one was born knowing instantly how to make warriors chararts they need teaching that's what the mentor program is for and the kit system, we could assign new users an apprentice mentor to show them the absolute basics, how to comment and how to use the tools then if the apprentice thinks they understand the kit could become an apprentice and start making art. Its not the user's fault no one even showed them the basics. WildfireMistystar's Omen! 02:13, December 12, 2011 (UTC)
But there're tons of tutorials out there for digital art. And the wiki has some too. It's there own fault if they don't take advantage of them. ~Breezewhisker~ 02:18, December 12, 2011 (UTC)
As Breezewhisker says, there are plenty of places for these people who aspire to join to go learn on their own time. Go read the project mission statement. The mission of the project is not to "create artists", it's to "create art"! The Kit & Mentor systems inundated the wiki with edits that brought nothing to the wiki. Edits that you brought things to the apprentice/kit. If you don't at least know the basics of digital art, you need to go learn them for yourself on your own time. Not on the wiki's time and resources. If a user can't spell, write's poorly, and harms articles with their edits constantly the wiki doesn't keep them. Why should Project Character Art be locked into accepting users who are not ready to join. Wildfire: If you want to teach people how to color things, offer to create a training camp on Deviantart or something, using the 8 million free-for-use cat line arts that are out there. Project Charart is a place to come to make art, not learn to make art. I would be perfectly in favor of a screening program that accepts only artists who prove that they can do basic coloring and shading. We're not talking about putting in a "must be able to do perfect tortoiseshell tabby cats with pristine shading before you can join. Just prove that you know the basics. Kitsufox Den/CoSC 02:27, December 12, 2011 (UTC)
I don't know about you Wildfire, but I learned how to do charart all by my lonesome. It's actually a heck of a lot easier than actual digital art, because you don't actually have to draw anything. It's just about blurring and proper shading positions. And there's tutorials on that too! oblivionAudience? 02:40, December 12, 2011 (UTC)
So there's that point made: people are perfectly capable of learning on their own if they really want to join PCA. Anything else to discuss on this? Shelly For a limited time only 03:25, December 12, 2011 (UTC)
- Not just perfectly capable, Shelly ;) Should be learning on their own. Learning in a high pressure, finished product oriented environment like the Project is just not a good idea. They should be practicing and having fun while they get ready for serious charart, not stressing about figuring out shading before their art gets auto-declined. Kitsufox Den/CoSC 13:17, December 12, 2011 (UTC)
Acutally, all of the leads deleted the other tutorials, go check. You can try being a new apprentice without a tuutorial to help you, the one we have is one only about GIMP and two messey it doesn't flow and looks complicated. Also I understand that you learned on your own I have too, but now that I have a mentor I feel more involved and I think I'm doing better, Oblivion. Really, this isn't fair too new users, it isn't their fault they haven't learned to make chararts. I looked back into the history and almost everyone here agreed there should be a mentor system so why are yo disagreeing here? A mentor helps an apprentice learn, then the apprentice has an assesment, so wouldn't it make more sense for us to do the same? WildfireMistystar's Omen! 00:50, December 13, 2011 (UTC)
They got rid of the multiple tutorials in order to make one all-encompassing tutorial that all warriors and leads can add to. And Wildfire, I understand that you may feel that this suggestion is aimed at you personally as your first charart took months to get approved, but we can't be doing that anymore. It isn't about being fair. It's about getting our job done. And it is a users fault if they try to join a digital art project without decent knowledge of how to make digital art. This would not get rid of the mentor system, though I believe we should. It would only make it so that those that cannot handle a project such as this don't join until they are really ready. Shelly For a limited time only 01:34, December 13, 2011 (UTC)
Erm, Wildfire, of course no one knows off the bat how to make chararts. ;) These things take time. That's why, before they can join the project, they should practice art on their own for a while, and than when they think they're ready, they can do the screening test. It make sthings so much simpler. We may have to hrt feelings, but where not supposed to be creating artists like Kitsu stated, were supposed to be making art. When people don't know how, and clutter the approval page with stuff, it's not our fault they can't make art. That's why they may need tim eto practice on their own. So when their confident they've improved drastically enough to make a basic charart, they may join the project. It's just easier this may. Sweetflower01:47 Tue Dec 13
I completely agree with this idea and with what all the other supporters said. :) ✤Featherwillow✤ Hmmm... HOHOHO!!! ✤✤ 18:37, December 17, 2011 (UTC)