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Forums: Index > Project Operations > Project Character Art > Inquiry of Iceheart22



Please note, first and foremost, that this discussion is not being held out of hatred or spite. Only out of need.

It is my opinion, as well as the opinion of others, that Iceheart is no longer the appropriate person to lead Project Character Art. Her handling of the project has proven to be inadequate and the current climate of near constant bickering reflects that.

Examples of her poor handling can be found specifically here, where she declined one image and approved two others earlier than the rules dictate in order to get her image onto the approval page, and, when reprimanded, accused a senior warrior of “playing leader”, here, where she attempted to push a rule through “as quickly as possible” without giving the proposal proper time for discussion, here, where once again she displayed only concern for what would get a rule passed fastest and not what would get a rule written correctly, and in just looking at PCA’s talk page and discussion archives, which show how often she takes part in bickering rather than attempting to solve disputes.

Iceheart has been warned formally that a vote of no confidence may be held against her, and her handling of PCA has not improved significantly.

This discussion, should the comments indicate the need, will lead to a vote of no confidence against Iceheart. Should it pass, leadership will be given to Scarletwind, with Iceheart becoming a senior warrior. --Shelly For a limited time only 05:26, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

I'm not gonna decide anything. She has poor leadership skills but...I guess she isn't fit to be leader, but she is responsible. -- Stoneclaw    05:27, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

As Stoney said, I'm not going to say anything. She has poor leadership skills, and it was very rude of her to say another SW was playing leader. IF it comes down to this, I think she should be made a SW. Silverhmm 13:01, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Slightly off topic, but I'll say it anyways. Keep in mind I'm staying out of the politics of this, and not making any statement of opinion here. This is related entirely to the process as this VoNC will establish the precedent other projects will follow in the future. Due to the fact that Scarletwind was appointed by Iceheart, if this vote goes through I would support an election for a new leader from amongst any Senior Warriors who wish to be included on the ballot. Normal movement from Deputy to Leader isn't appropriate in this case. I would also support the inclusion of any Warrior if they can get 2 Senior Warriors to endorse them.  Kitsufox  Den/CoSC 14:32, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Seems fair. A vote held on the nominations page would be best, and I think Scarlet would win anyway. Shelly For a limited time only 15:29, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, sounds good to me too. Though I think, despite Iceheart being the one to choose her, she's fit to be leader. I think she'd do a good job. PaleLegs ♪Be prepared...♪ 15:51, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

I'm not sure if I'm allowed to vote but from the examples Shelly put up it has shown that Iceheart is a bad leader, but she isn't terrible, I think she should get demoted but we should let her defend herself, it seems this project has gotten more exclusive, despite all the attempts to stop that, I think Scarletwind will make a wonderful leader, and maybe change things back to the way they were. WildfireMistystar's Omen! 16:10, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Of course Iceheart is allowed to defend herself. What exactly is stopping her? Shelly For a limited time only 16:13, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Iceheart came on when I left in 2010, and I have to admit she did have trouble getting on the horse. However, I just believe that stress and overwhelming life is fueling these accusuations. Like fire, let's let it burn, and forgive and forget. She is responsible, though. User:QuailflightTheCat/Sig 17:10, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

I don't know how much my opinion counts, but yes, I think Iceheart's leader days are coming to a close. I'm really getting tired of all the drama, even if I'm not involved in any of it. I'm not saying it's all her fault, but maybe better leadership and patience qualities on her part could have stopped some of it. User:Shadewing/Sig 17:39, January 15, 2012 (UTC) Shadewing

I know I am just an apprentice, but seeing the links that have been provided, I think that PCA would be able to benefit from a new leader. Iceheart has had her day in the sun and has made some poor leadership choices, so I would agree with having her become a SW and having a new leader. User:A Cat Named Cheshire/Sig

I truly do think this is for the best. I have nothing personal against Iceheart, I just think that she's not the best person to lead the PCA anymore. I think Scarlet, or whoever we end up voting for will be much better. And it's not like we're kicking her out of the project. We just don't want our project to be lead to a point where's it's not accomplishing anything, and just bickering among ourselves. we need someone who can calm down the drama, not fuel it more. It's what's best for the PCA. If we keep on like we have, the project might as well close, since we're not really getting anything down at this rate, and I know none of us want that to happen. So I think this is the best choice. If Icy's been warned before, we already know she's not gonna change, and she's been giving enough of a chance to. If we keep up with this the project will be driven into the ground. So I support this, and I think this is the best thing for the project. Again, no offence to Icy or anyone else, this just isn't working, that's all. PaleLegs ♪Be prepared...♪ 21:30, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Paleh. We are going to need a a kind, but strong leader. And in those links Icy didn't show the right qualities. Honestly, Iceheart is responsible, smart, and an awesome charartist but I don't think she's fit to be leader. Sorry. These days have too much drama, and Icy hasn't been very calming.  Stoneclaw    21:43, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Paleclaw too. With all the drama PCA has been going through lately, Iceheart didn't really solve the problems, in some way, she sorta made 'em worse. I'm sorry Iceheart, but PCA is going no where with a more unfit leader than a fit leader. I do not mean to offend you, and I'm sorry if I do/did, but the truth has to come out... Sweetflower14:01 Mon Jan 16

I haven't said much to either side of the issue... But I feel like now is the time to say at least something. I think some of the biggest problems PCA has were in motion before Icy became leader. She's just not as adept as past leaders have been at dealing with conflict and placing limits on it. These conflicts have long been rising in this project, and they've... slipped their rein, so to say. I'm not going to speak for or against the removal of Icy, but I caution you all to think very hard about the vote might cast, and who has the backbone to deal with the drama that's been an inherent part of this project for a long time. Think hard, and think carefully. Don't let your personal feelings get in the way of the facts you're seeing. Now is not the time for emotion. It's the time for the future of the project and the path into it to be considered.  Kitsufox  Den/CoSC 18:31, January 16, 2012 (UTC)

Kitsu's statement makes perfect sense to me. This is more than electing a new leader of PCA. This is about thinking carefully about the past, where we might've gone wrong and correcting our mistakes. I'm not saying that this is Iceheart's fault, nor any of ours entirely. However we got to this point won't matter too much, so long as we can fix it. I'm not saying that I am the best person to fix it; in fact I highly doubt that. But I'm willing to think carefully about what went wrong and help the project move forward to become better.

Right now, a couple things make sense to me that we need to fix:

  1. The drama level needs to come down. In order to do this, all users have to acknowledge that PCA is not about laying claim to chararts, nor the number of chararts we can dish out in a certain amount of time. PCA is about creating high-quality images for the articles of the Warriors Wiki. Once our goal is complete, PCA's job will be done, but it doesn't look like that will be soon, as there is a new series coming out.
  2. PCA goes through a lot of rule and leadership changes. I think that project needs to slow down and at least try an idea for an amount of time before we speak out saying that it's no good and that it needs to change.
  3. There is a lot of friction between users of the project (and I admit, I've been part of this problem as well). Users have friends that they know better than other and fights can break out. But since PCA is such a big project and requires a lot more communication then other projects, friendships and rivalries have to be put aside for the good of the project and achieving our goal.

This is how I see the problem. If others disagree, that's fine, I won't get mad. But things in PCA might need to change in order for the project to flow smoother. ScarletwindGo Beyond Plus Ultra!! 20:19, January 16, 2012 (UTC)

What Scarlet just said makes sense, and I agree with her. I think everyone's a little highstrung, and at eachother's throats at this point. (Expression) Sweetflower20:26 Mon Jan 16

Just a warning: If there is a vote, choose wisely, as the choices you make affect PCA's future.  Stoneclaw    01:50, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

At this point it does look like a vote to verify consensus is at least in order (though that could change).  Kitsufox  Den/CoSC 02:17, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

I've never really participated in these conflicts, but if I have, I've never been the center of the fight. But those links Shellheart gave us gives us proof that a: the drama level in PCA is just too high, and b: Iceheart doesn't solve our problems. She is a great member of the project, but not a fit leader. I think Scarletwind would make a great leader for the future of PCA. ~DJCandyFun~ I do enjoy fun...8D01:59, Tue, Jan, 17, 2012

Okay, everyone, that's all true. Our next leader should be chosen very carefully. But we're here to discuss whether or not Iceheart should be impeached. Who replaces her comes after that. Shelly For a limited time only 02:04, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

Call me crazy, but, I don't think we should have a vote to decide (if at all) the next leader. It's only natural that Scarlet succeed Iceheart. Just because she was chosen by Iceheart, doesn't mean she'll do the same thing. Scarlet is a lot more level-headed then Iceheart is, and is defiantly able to become a leader this project can be proud of. I don't see why we have to elect someone new, when a great leader is already around. Just because Iceheart made mistakes, doesn't mean Scarlet will.

As for Iceheart, I'm sorry. I respect you as an artist, but, I think the time has come for you to pass down the project to a new leader. I'm not saying you need to leave the project, or the wiki in general. Your skills are second to none when compared to today's artists, and that's something we need. However, you as leader... I'm really sorry for saying this, but, I think you've abused the rights given to you as leader of PCA. Jayce  ( ) 20:43, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

This Inquiry calls into question Iceheart's policies. Scarlet is one of Iceheart's policies. She would, however, automatically be on the ballot for a vote to decide things if Iceheart is VoNCed. All other contenders would need to be nominated to be on the ballot. We need to prove that she has the faith and the trust of the community given the situation. This is not a normal situation, the normal succession is not appropriate to arbitrating the next leader.  Kitsufox  Den/CoSC 14:23, January 18, 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry Iceheart... but I have to agree. Your an amazing artist and all, but I think your not the appropriate person to be Leader. Once, again, I'm really sorry for saying this. I'm trying not to be mean. --SnowyXPerry = Serry! 22:39, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

Cloudy, while I agree Scarlet will make an amazing leader, I do think we should have a vote. It gives us the chance to pick the best possible leader, even if it isn't Scarlet. Chances are my vote will go to her, but I still do think it'd be a good idea. PaleLegs ♪Be prepared...♪ 01:15, January 18, 2012 (UTC)

Okay, again, we can discuss that later. Can we please discuss the removal of our current leader before moving on to a new one? Shelly For a limited time only 04:51, January 18, 2012 (UTC)

Honestly, I've been watching the arguments and I will say that I don't think, at the moment, Iceheart is the right user to lead PCA. Her chararts are marvelous, but...I'm sorry...She isn't the right person to be leading this project. User:Twilightheart200/Sig 04:57, January 18, 2012 (UTC)

I do not think that Iceheart is quite the right person to lead the project at the moment. She hasn't done a bad job, but...I've seen the drama, and the leader should be preventing and solving it, not contributing to it. That's just my opinion. Breezewhisker 05:04, January 18, 2012 (UTC)

FINAL CALL FOR COMMENTS

Given the clear consensus that's existing right now, I'm going to announce that comments will cease to be taken on the 22nd. Right now discussion indicates that the vote should happen (but this is not a final decision). Discussion, focused on the need or lack therefor a vote, may continue. Please understand that further discussion of the need/lack of need for a vote should Iceheart be voted out should not continue (I will not support otherwise, and save for the other two Sysops coming at me in disagreement, I will not handle it any differently. Either you guys trust Iceheart's policies or you don't. There is no middle ground in this case)  Kitsufox  Den/CoSC 14:23, January 18, 2012 (UTC)

According to Wildheart, Iceheart may be stpeeing down. In such a case, succession should happen normally with Scarlet becoming leader as any deputy would when a leader steps down. However, I feel it would be best if we wait for an official statement from Iceheart, lest we act too hastily. Shelly For a limited time only 01:48, January 19, 2012 (UTC)

Conclusion

As Iceheart has stepped down, this forum is closed. Scarletwind will succeed Iceheart. Shelly For a limited time only 02:35, January 19, 2012 (UTC)

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